this post was submitted on 24 Feb 2024

539 points (97.5% liked)

Technology

59204 readers

3505 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.

Our Rules

Follow the lemmy.world rules.
Only tech related content.
Be excellent to each another!
Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
Politics threads may be removed.
No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed

Approved Bots

founded 1 year ago

MODERATORS

539

Reddit has never turned a profit in nearly 20 years, but filed to go public anyway (www.cnn.com)

submitted 8 months ago by L4s@lemmy.world to c/technology@lemmy.world

68 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Reddit has never turned a profit in nearly 20 years, but filed to go public anyway::Reddit, the message board site known for its chronically online userbase and for originating much internet discourse, filed for its long-anticipated initial public offering on Thursday.

top 50 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] deweydecibel@lemmy.world 168 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (5 children)

Problem is the entire concept of a site like reddit being "for profit" in the first place.

I know we all wax nostalgic about the old non-centralized Internet with its various small websites and forums, but one thing I do genuinely miss from those days was that those places existed because the people running them wanted them to exist. They had ads or took donations to keep the lights on, but no one was looking to get rich. Passion, not profit.

The decentralized internet was run more by people, the centralized internet is run by board rooms.

That's why I like the idea of the fediverse. That is why this place feels familiar to those early days.

[–] superduperenigma@lemmy.world 49 points 8 months ago (2 children)

I still remember clicking a bunch of irrelevant ads for knives and other weird shit on a forum I visited regularly because the owner said they get slightly more money when ads get clicked on site.

I'm doing my part!

[–] residentmarchant@lemmy.world 29 points 8 months ago

And in the days before tracking cookies, doing that didn't ruin all the ads you'll ever see again

[–] DrRatso@lemmy.ml 19 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Ads don’t even bother me inherently. It’s part the maximum obnoxiousness of them these days, of course. But most of all, if I do manage to see an ad (like in a mobile app), I get irrationally annoyed at the fact that it is supposed to be tailored to me and yet here I am looking at a 20 second unskippable ad for something I would never in a million years care for.

[–] slimarev92@lemmy.world 17 points 8 months ago

There was a simple version of reddit that could be profitable without compromising what made it enjoyable for the users, but the suits had to go chasing after a bunch of fads (remember bow they tries to produce a series of video AMAs?).

[–] thecrotch@sh.itjust.works 10 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

The "old internet" hasn't gone away. It's easier than ever for your average person to set up their own website. Look at all the shit you can do with WordPress, usually for free and usually with minimal technical knowledge or experience. Reddit/Facebook/Google/etc have done nothing at all to prevent people from doing that. The people still choose reddit/Facebook/google. I don't know we're supposed to change that without actually removing people's freedom of choice.

[–] Hate@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

The people still choose reddit/Facebook/google. I don't know we're supposed to change that without actually removing people's freedom of choice.

In my opinion/experience, it's for a few reasons. People are marketed these centralized platforms, typically they're very/fairly simple to use, and those platforms already have an established userbase. Combined with the other factors, the userbase will keep growing, which also incentivizes Even more users to adopt the platform.

For most people, there's no incentive to use some small random forum. And these small random forums aren't typically run for profit, meaning people aren't paying for ads for their niche forum or hobby website because it's just a hobby, not a business run for profit. Whereas people will see countless ads for Instagram or TikTok. Typically, people who don't block ads, and use these sorts of media didn't care enough to bother looking for alternative platforms, they couldn't even be bothered to set up an adblocker.

[–] june@lemmy.world 7 points 8 months ago

I have no qualms with a person making a comfortable living off of building a website like Reddit. None at all. I’d rather have someone who’s able to dedicate their full time and even a team to making an experience great for users and making a very healthy living off of it.

But yea, spez is a greedy fuck and the ELT at Reddit are all greedy fucks. Reddit has no business being a publicly traded company.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] topperharlie@lemmy.world 140 points 8 months ago (4 children)

honestly, it has the word AI somewhere in their last year activities, even if they don't do it themselves.

Investors are dumb as fuck, they know nothing about anything other than keywords and hype trains, so with the AI keyword they might go crazy on this.

I keep saying it, the stock market is a mistake for humanity, it doesn't make sense to put a gambling house in the core of the world economy.

[–] ininewcrow@lemmy.ca 72 points 8 months ago

But it isn't gambling ... It's managed and calculated financing in companies that need the investment in order to grow

I'm kidding, this is sarcasm .. the stock market is a freakin casino with built in cheats and frauds that favor the rich and wealthy.

[–] deweydecibel@lemmy.world 35 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

The stock market, much like capitalism in general, is useful if regulated properly, but the inherent corrosive nature of human greed on any regulatory system will eventually erode those regulations down and let this shit run rampant. There are genuine benefits to it, but they're buried beneath the sheer scale of wealth begetting more wealth at the expense of everyone else.

Part of it is that, to spite it being "gambling", it sure doesn't feel like there's a lot of losing going on with the biggest players. They don't seem to need to be as careful as you or I would need to be. It'd be one thing if it was fair gambling, but it isn't.

load more comments (2 replies)

[–] RedEyeFlightControl@lemmy.world 81 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Perhaps if the ceo wasn't making like 200m a year, it would show some profits

[–] Lulzagna@lemmy.world 32 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

Not to be that guy, but I think he makes 300k and was given 193m in stock options last year based on some whack evaluation.

Still an utterly insane number, hope they get crushed on the public market

[–] MataVatnik@lemmy.world 22 points 8 months ago (2 children)

He paid himself 193 mil because he knows its not going to be worth more than 1.93 mil after the IPO.

load more comments (2 replies)

[–] ugjka@lemmy.world 17 points 8 months ago

Hollywood accounting tactics probably aswell

[–] unreasonabro@lemmy.world 64 points 8 months ago (1 children)

but they've cleaned the site up so much! I mean they got rid of all of us, didn't they

[–] IDontHavePantsOn@lemm.ee 13 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Next is that pesky porn problem that makes up most of the traffic.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] tsonfeir@lemm.ee 57 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (3 children)

Because the stock market is a scam and whoever is valuing these companies so high is clearly in on it. Any company that has no profit ~~is~~ should be worth nothing in an IPO.

Edit: strikethrough, to be more clearly an opinion.

[–] AdmiralShat@programming.dev 41 points 8 months ago (2 children)

If a business was actually losing money for 20 years straight then how does it continue to grow? Think about Amazon and how long it wasn't profitable despite being one of the largest businesses ever in recorded history.

It's a business scam that's a legal way of pay significantly less taxes than they normally would.

[–] originalucifer@moist.catsweat.com 25 points 8 months ago (1 children)

dont forget getting to gamble with other peoples forced retirement accounts! yay!

[–] AdmiralShat@programming.dev 5 points 8 months ago (3 children)

Haven't most places moved to 401ks for this reason? I'd never participate in a pension and I imagine the vast majority of those working in the tech industry are smart enough not to as well

I could be wrong I'm basing all this on assumptions about others intelligence

[–] originalucifer@moist.catsweat.com 17 points 8 months ago (1 children)

wouldnt it be cool if retirement didnt rely on the market, at all? in any capacity. like, if we werent forced to go with a 'lower risk' tier of the house of cards.

[–] AdmiralShat@programming.dev 10 points 8 months ago

The value of money is based on the market, all aspects of finance are based on economies. Even just a straight up savings account gradually devalues

We fucked up a species when we traded communities for economies.

[–] bassomitron@lemmy.world 4 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Pensions are amazing, why the hell would you not want one? 401ks are nice, too, and ideally you find a gig that does both. Yes, there are some companies that have fucked their employees' pensions over, but those are in the minority and doing so is illegal, so those companies tend to be doing other illegal shit as well (e.g. the infamous case of Enron).

[–] AdmiralShat@programming.dev 7 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

A 401k is something, an account, I legally own. A pension is a promise.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] SorteKanin@feddit.dk 11 points 8 months ago

If a business was actually losing money for 20 years straight then how does it continue to grow?

It's because it keeps getting funded by venture capitalists, as far as I understand. Keeping it afloat because they believe it will eventually bring a return on that investment.

I feel like investments used to be a reasonable thing. Like some rich fella or a fund organization or something invested in a thing and then a little later (couple years at most I would say) it's profitable and can start paying back the investment (which was essentially a loan).

Now it's become more and more pyramid-scheme-esque. You start with a small funding round to get a bit of growth but you still grow faster than profits can keep up with. Then you get a slightly bigger funding round but you also grow slightly faster. Then you repeat this for 20 years and then you have Reddit's situation I suppose.

But it seems crazy. Why is there so much money in the world being spent for this potential return? I get it, investments do enable innovation and new businesses and all that. That's the supposed benefit of capitalism. But it's starting to feel ridiculous when it goes on for so long without ever producing a surplus of value.

[–] Windex007@lemmy.world 5 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Any company that has no profit is worth nothing in an IPO.

I envy people with the bravery to speak passionately about something they don't understand at all.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 8 months ago (1 children)

How much is it worth for the power to push an agenda onto 850,000,000 people?

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] DarkThoughts@fedia.io 23 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Given Spez's salary I'd say they definitely make a buck.

[–] db2@lemmy.world 5 points 8 months ago

He's going to take it all.

[–] scarabic@lemmy.world 22 points 8 months ago (3 children)

I think people don’t understand just how good Facebook is at ads. Their relevance engine is unlike anything else. If something 1/3 as effective could be done to Reddit, this place would be making billions.

I’ve run ads on Facebook and I’ve run ads on Reddit. Facebook was like a massage with a happy ending, and Resdit was like being shat on by a vagrant.

There’s absolutely no reason Reddit couldn’t be making tons of money with as much as they know about hobbies and interests in general, and the free traffic they are able to draw to such a mountain of niche content.

I hope not to see Reddit go the way of Facebook. But to say it couldn’t make a profit is not true.

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 5 points 8 months ago

I feel like the average Reddit user is more likely to be running Adblock than the average Facebook user.

[–] Nurgle@lemmy.world 3 points 8 months ago

People talk about Reddit and AI in terms of what Reddit will do for those LLMs. But I imagine another part of it has to be what they’ll do for Reddit. Like redditors volunteer sooo much information that it’s really an advertises dream if you can start to thread it together.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] jimp@lemm.ee 20 points 8 months ago

Fucking arseholes. It has been my imaginary home since it started and now I have to use fucking mastodon and bluesky fucking dicks.
On the plus side, Lemmy has been getting really good recently

[–] LiveLM@lemmy.zip 12 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

I hope their IPO comes crashing down in flames.

Didn't think I'd be here hoping for the failure of what used to be my favorite website but here we are.

[–] Artyom@lemm.ee 11 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Most tech companies aren't profitable when they go public, that's been true as long as the tech industry existed.

[–] ChunkMcHorkle@lemmy.world 10 points 8 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

deleted by creator

[–] butterflyattack@lemmy.world 5 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Why on earth would they give those sweet pre-IPO shares up to the unwashed masses if they thought there was even a remote chance the IPO would at least break even?

I suspect it's because they're worried that their users are going to short them and encourage others to do the same, so they're trying to get them involved and committed. They don't want WSB causing shit. My guess is that the share prices will do pretty well, at least initially. There are plenty of ignorant investors who want to get in on the next big tech stock. Just a guess though, I don't know enough about this stuff to invest in stocks myself.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world 10 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

I smell a short position in my future after that IPO...

[–] sebinspace@lemmy.world 8 points 8 months ago

Imagine the absolute conflict of interest that is r/WSB

[–] nodsocket@lemmy.world 7 points 8 months ago

Who else is going to short?

[–] kylian0087@lemmy.world 7 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Hoe does this work. If a company has not made a profit in 20 years. How is it not bankrupt?

[–] wurosh@lemmy.ml 17 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)

You keep telling the next investor it'll be profitable soon. I believe the guy that came up with this scheme first went to prison or something, but afterwards we all collectively decided we were cool with it.

[–] whoscheckingin@lemmy.ml 8 points 8 months ago

That's why they need to go public in the first place. Investors are like it's right now or you're shutting down, no more free money for you.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] Telodzrum@lemmy.world 7 points 8 months ago

Ahh…Tech industry, never change

[–] autotldr@lemmings.world 3 points 8 months ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:

Reddit, the message board site known for its chronically online userbase and for originating much internet discourse, filed for its long-anticipated initial public offering on Thursday.

The filing comes nearly three years after Reddit hired its first chief financial officer, and executives, including co-founder and CEO Steve Huffman, began publicly discussing the possibility of an IPO to further elevate the company’s profile.

Reddit, which has called itself the “front page of the internet,” is a social media veteran: the company started in 2005, the year that college roommates Huffman and Ohanian graduated from the University of Virginia.

In 2021, Reddit caused mass market upheaval when a community of day traders on the platform called WallStreetBets began buying up shares of GameStop in an effort to hurt hedge funds that bet against the stock.

Thursday’s filing offers the most detailed look yet at the state of Reddit’s business, which seeks to grow beyond the traditional ad-supported model upon which most social platforms continue to heavily rely.

And while Reddit said it expects its total addressable market in advertising to grow to $1.4 trillion by 2027, it also acknowledged in the filing’s risk factors disclosure that it has “a history of net losses and we may not be able to achieve or maintain profitability in the future.”

The original article contains 933 words, the summary contains 215 words. Saved 77%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

[–] jimmydoreisalefty@lemmy.world 3 points 8 months ago (2 children)

Profit

Does it have shell companies that Reddit offloads its profit to...

Might be similar to twitter or news media, influence is worth more to its owners?

Data is valuable as well...

Top 10% own stock, so that can also be part of the stock games...

[–] TurtleJoe@lemmy.world 4 points 8 months ago

Reddit has been a private company for its entire existence. There really isn't a point in it making a profit, as long as the people running it are paying themselves.

load more comments (1 replies)

load more comments