this post was submitted on 25 Jan 2025
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Let's start with my mistakes:

  • I haven't followed LKML.
  • I assumed: Every ThinkPad has - overall - perfect Linux support, so this will as well.
  • I did look up support when purchasing but I was still not verifying on the LKML.
  • Edit: I trusted Qualcomm's marketing

So, I wanted a ARM-Linux laptop so bad. I heared about the Lenovo ThinkPad X13s in 2023 and I looked at marketing promises and (rare!) takes on it. Then there was the opportunity to buy this laptop fir a good price with the entire stats I would require for my next 10+ years. So I bought it.

In order to bake Linux on it I had to read up upon many things - I run it daily but have to accept some downsizes.

Anyhow, I thought this title would be interessting regarding Lenovo's and Qualcomm's "success" on ARM so that others may be aware that I am looking daily for the LKML and my model SC8280XP.

There is ONE SINGLE CONTRIBUTOR (there were two; The other joined Lenovo) allowed to have "elected and requested" documents in order to aid support. Despite their intentions (QUALCOMM) to support Linux. And I furthermore assume it hasn't have changed with the new Snapdragon X processors.

So, thanks to John Hovold and Linaro for doing an awesome job. I wish I could support you.

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[–] superkret@feddit.org 90 points 5 days ago (27 children)

I'll be honest, this sounds interesting, but I have no idea what you're even trying to say.
Where does the $2700 price come from?
Does it support Linux or not?
Are you happy with it or not?
What's LKMS?
I'm really struggling to even parse the basics from your post.

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[–] sleepmode@lemmy.world 20 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Lenovo artificially inflates the [M]SRP and has fake “sales” to make it seem like you’re getting a good deal. Never ever trust that.

As you discovered there is often one single person working on getting these devices compatible. As an example the OpenBSD team and others will sometimes suggest you donate a system in order for anything to happen. And even then there are no guarantees if blobs are involved.

This is a pretty big goof up but I’ve made the same mistake when the x200 first came out. I think you’re getting dragged because what people are curious about is what specifically isn’t working. I’m surprised it’s working at all but then again John is a beast.

[–] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 4 points 5 days ago (1 children)

This is true for tons of companies across the board

[–] sleepmode@lemmy.world 1 points 5 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

The fake sale, blobs, proprietary nonsense etc things? Can confirm I’ve seen others pull the same crap. For me Lenovo was the most blatant. But Dell came close. If you have other examples I’d like to see it.

[–] MadhuGururajan@programming.dev 12 points 5 days ago (3 children)

Why didn't you buy a framework, or even a macbook and run asahi Linux on it?

Asahi is not suitable for daily driver yet afaik. But Framework is a good one.

[–] 7dev7random7@suppo.fi 4 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

A friend of mine bought an used M1 and Linux support is limited to this day. I just want to run Debian (stable).

Framework doesn't have (and still hasn't) an aarch64 CPU.

The benefits of an ARM-Linux based laptop for me are:

  • Running my obiquitious OS (Debian).
  • No fans and less heat on the lap (note that charging heats the battery which in turn heats the laptop. Though this is just 25 Minutes to charge up and this laptop [X13s] cools down very fast)
  • battery life (I can safely assume 6 heavy hours of no-plugin vim, REPL and browsing).

You may come up with downsizes and I bet I can address these with easy workarounds to stay within my requirements.

[–] something_random_tho@lemmy.world 14 points 5 days ago (2 children)

I get all those stated benefits on my Framework 13 AMD, except my battery life is longer.

[–] bitwolf@sh.itjust.works 4 points 5 days ago (1 children)

How? I barely get 6 hours of just browsing, and it can only suspend for a day.

[–] something_random_tho@lemmy.world 2 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Are you using power-profiles-daemon?

For Framework Laptop 13/16 AMD Ryzen™ 7040 Series configurations, you will absolutely want to use power-profiles-daemon for the absolute best experience. Do NOT use TLP.

https://knowledgebase.frame.work/en_us/optimizing-ubuntu-battery-life-Sye_48Lg3

[–] bitwolf@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Yes, I am. I also set both the power profile and epp to power save.

Are you using Mario's patched ppd by chance?

[–] something_random_tho@lemmy.world 3 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

I'm using whatever comes prepackaged with NixOS unstable: services.power-profiles-daemon.enable = lib.mkDefault true;

[–] 7dev7random7@suppo.fi 4 points 5 days ago

Yeah; Told you I am disappointed in some way.

[–] Thorry84@feddit.nl 6 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I assume the 2700 is SRP? Don't use SRP ever, it's total nonsense. It has in fact become such nonsense use of SRP in marketing/sales is actually illegal in the EU. Instead of it being an actual price point manufacturers intended for the product to be sold at, it's always always a factor of that. So shops could advertise with a 50% discount on SRP, to get at what is just the regular price and not even a good one at that. That was considered so misleading, SRP use is banned. Instead the marketing can only be based on actual lowest prices the product was for sale at.

[–] 7dev7random7@suppo.fi -5 points 5 days ago

You may chime in here: I purchased it with three years of support as well (they [Lenovo] exchanged my brickes speakers, btw).

[–] 7dev7random7@suppo.fi 5 points 5 days ago

More insights I gained using this laptop (intended for the curious Linux enthusiast):

  • Kernel support for Audio and Screens is heavily dependend on user space: X.org and Wayland experience differs immensely. Even some udev-rules only work with certain compositors (and X11 feels like it is out of scope).
  • Debian lacks people contributing to the linux and linux-firmware package. The onboarding is quite steep due to a lack of alignment between code and documentation.
  • Developers if userspace programs react very fast to new requirements but they rely on upstreamed (to Debian's kernel-team) kernel-config's.
  • Prompting bugs to the kernel appears to be done through kernel contributors only: Users will prompt hindrances on IRC (via OTFC, #aarch64-laptops) prompting the contributor and they will verify and support before addressing issues.
  • There are archived advancements to the support which can't be merged due to citation reasons and alignment with upstream can't be done by the individual (there is a pareto-capable kernel for virtualization but within one week hunderts of commits need to get reviewed). This is impressive imo.
[–] lurch@sh.itjust.works 1 points 4 days ago

If it comes with Windows pre installed, that's a big red flag for me. Also there will be the cost of a license for it included in the cost that MS will pocket giving nothing in return.

[–] JokeDeity@lemm.ee 2 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I've never bought any of my laptops new because I can't wrap my head around how they justify those prices. $2700 for a laptop? I wouldn't pay $700 for a laptop, and I'm sure my PC is far more powerful than this laptop that I paid a fraction of the cost for.

[–] JokeDeity@lemm.ee -1 points 3 days ago

OMG I figured it out. English isn't your first language. THAT'S why you don't make any sense what-so-ever in almost every one of your comments. You basically have a child's understanding of the language coupled with the belief that you have mastered the language.

[–] xilliah@beehaw.org 1 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Didn't Lenovo have some privacy issues, like a key logger or sum iirc? Kinda a vague memory but I remember that's why I didn't buy one.

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