this post was submitted on 16 Apr 2024
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[–] chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world 134 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (34 children)

I have a real problem with this, and I've been on both sides of it. It really doesn't do anything to help your cause by having people stuck in traffic. There are many reasons that someone could be in their car at that moment, not just commuting to or from a job. They could be on their way to a court appointment, they could have dinner in the car, they could be going to pick their child up from school, they could be on their way to a doctor's appointment, or any of a million other reasons that make this not just an inconvenience, but a complete shithead thing for someone to put someone else through. Protestors aren't making their case against the war by pissing off every person stuck in traffic, they are just being dickheads. If you want to protest a war, go hang out outside of a government building, or in front of an elected official's house. Make them feel uncomfortable, not some poor schmuck who has somewhere else to be at the moment.

Edit: Ok, I guess I need to give a peaceful example. You want to block traffic? Block the exits to the parking garage where the elected officials park downtown. Do that for a week and see how much of an impact you make. Blocking commuters is a waste of energy.

[–] witten@lemmy.world 84 points 7 months ago (3 children)

I don't think the goal is to convince the people stuck in the artificially created traffic about Gaza. I think it's to get news coverage from sites like nbcnews.com so as to raise the profile of the Gaza war so that politicians must address it. You are welcome to argue whether that's an effective strategy, but I think that's the intent.

Also, side note.. Social progress rarely comes from rule following.

[–] chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world 27 points 7 months ago (7 children)

Is the profile not high enough? I'm pretty sure everyone knows about it who needs to know about it. Blocking traffic isn't going to make a ceasefire happen across the world. Annoying your fellow citizens and ruining their day isn't getting any politicians to act. It's pointless. Actions must be taken against those in charge if we want to see any forward progress. Blocking traffic to protest a war is like yelling at a frycook because you want the McRib back. The actions are being aimed at the wrong people.

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[–] return2ozma@lemmy.world 59 points 7 months ago (2 children)
[–] aeronmelon@lemmy.world 68 points 7 months ago (9 children)

They're not in front of the White House, they're not even in front of city hall, they're hurting their own.

The King loves it when the peasants fight amongst themselves.

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[–] chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world 33 points 7 months ago

Not sure if you are agreeing with me or not, but that is exactly what I'm saying. Right now, blocking traffic is about as easy for the "king" to ignore as anything else.

[–] nulluser@programming.dev 27 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (10 children)

Yeah. I saw some of the posts across Lemmy trying to organize this.

There it was presented as blocking shipping ports. I thought that was odd. Wasn't sure how that was going to affect Israel, but whatever.

Then the day comes and they're doing this low effort reposting-of-a-meme-everyone-has-seen-already version of protest and I just rolled my eyes.

"Innocent people are being murdered in Palestine, so I'm going to go prevent someone that also hates what is happening from visiting their dying grandmother! That'll show 'em!"

🙄

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[–] Otakulad@lemmy.world 21 points 7 months ago

Completely agree. Blocking the average Joe driving home will get attention, but potentially for the wrong reason. I think your edit is perfect. Inconvenience those in power that can do something about it now, not someone who can really only do something when voting.

[–] CliveRosfield@lemmy.world 17 points 7 months ago (4 children)

I feel bad for the people in traffic but the protestors only get to this state because of repeatedly being ignored by the government. If normal protests aren’t cutting it anymore and you don’t want to be violent then what options do you really have? They (gov) just don’t listen.

[–] chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world 18 points 7 months ago (15 children)

Protest where it is effective, not where it gets you the most social media clout. Blocking traffic is the protesting equivalent of a selfie. Make some noise near an elected official, and often. See how quickly they change their attitude when they are the ones being fucked with.

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[–] Riccosuave@lemmy.world 14 points 7 months ago (13 children)

/agree

I fully support the cause, but this just ain't the way to effectively protest the system. I feel the same way about the climate activists throwing soup on art instalation (yes I know they are all protected, but to the average person you still look like an ignorant fucking asshole).

If you want to spur change, then you need to make it uncomfortable for your representatives to take a public position than conflicts with your ethics. Do so peacefully, but forcefully and as often as is feasible. You are much more likely to garner public support that way, and normies generally love anything that make politicians look bad.

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[–] Aceticon@lemmy.world 14 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (2 children)

The objective is to appear in the News, which will result in way more people becoming aware of just how many people are against what Israel is doing in Gaza and the US Administration's support of it, which in turn will lead others to become more open about they themselves being against it since they will feel that "we are many" rather than "it's just me" - grassroots movements independent of established politicial and media networks, no matter how many potential supporters they have, must be seen in order to grow otherwise they'll just fizzle away and nothing will change.

That usually means some kind of stunt in an important and highly public place which is almost certain to affect lots of members of the public.

Barelly disturbing a handful of politicians as you suggest would not make the News unless the Press was already there for some other reason and it would still have to be some kind of stunt (think the Iraqi guy that threw his shoe at George Bush) for the Press to even mention it in the news.

Unfortunatelly in the World we live in people have to use marketing strategies to merelly be seen, more so to have soap box to be heard by the rest of the nation, especially in Theatre Of Democracy countries were the "choice" is either pre-selected A or pre-selected B, and were the Press is not at all a Pillar Of Democracy independent of the Political Pillar but is pretty much joined at the hip with Political and/or Wealth Powers.

If it had the kind of Political and Press environment were those things could just be done the way you naivelly (or maybe misleadingly) suggest, the US would be quite a different place in terms of Power, Voice and Representativeness and not one where the only electoral "choice" is between two genocide-loving presidential candidates.

[–] sudo@programming.dev 16 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Media attention is a failed outdated tactic.

https://www.a15action.com/

The proposal states that in each city, we will identify and blockade major choke points in the economy, focusing on points of production and circulation with the aim of causing the most economic impact, as did the port shutdowns in recent months in Oakland, California and Melbourne, Australia, as just a few examples.

Hurting the rich's pocket books is the only language they respect. Now I'm not sure blocking roads is the most effective form of this tactic. Usually you use labor unions. But they're probably just working with what they have.

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[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 119 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (80 children)

ITT- You're allowed your first amendment right to protest war crimes, just not where I can see or be inconvenienced. Because all of the civil rights and anti war protests in the past 70 years that were truly successful were very polite and inconvenienced no one.

[–] BlitzoTheOisSilent@lemmy.world 129 points 7 months ago (11 children)

MLK Jr. literally wrote about this exact same thing in his Letter from Birmingham jail.

that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Councilor or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to ‘order’ than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: ‘I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action’; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a ‘more convenient season.’ ”

[–] Maggoty@lemmy.world 39 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Yeah I remember reading that in college. He wasn't the bland platitudes guy high schools teach.

[–] grue@lemmy.world 36 points 7 months ago (1 children)

He was also assassinated right after he started pivoting from civil rights to economic inequality (starting the Poor People's Campaign). Funny coincidence, that.

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[–] manuallybreathing@lemmy.ml 14 points 7 months ago

it's just not a good time guys, maybe next year when things are better!

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[–] capem@startrek.website 34 points 7 months ago (32 children)

Nice.

If Americans want the protests to stop, they should stop supporting genocide.

[–] Woht24@lemmy.world 17 points 7 months ago (32 children)

Mm and how has the average San Franciscan contributed to a war on the other side of the planet?

[–] Jamil@lemm.ee 41 points 7 months ago (1 children)

The same way the average American contributed to black oppression. By being silent observers to your government's actions.

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[–] go_go_gadget@lemmy.world 17 points 7 months ago (6 children)

In the same way we all do. Those weapons can't be built without a reliable economy. Interruptions in labor produce ripple effects which disrupt the atrocities of the capitalist class.

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[–] sparky@lemmy.federate.cc 20 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Unfortunately any protest in the US is at best constrained to stopping future weapons shipments to Israel. But as Netanyahu has already shown he doesn’t care what Biden has to say, the US is unlikely to be able to stop them from continuing to use the weapons they already have.

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[–] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 20 points 7 months ago

Direct action is super based.

[–] Simon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 19 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Can't wait to watch all the redditors who mostly don't commute or don't drive have a collective aneurysm over this.

[–] dhork@lemmy.world 24 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Honestly, Bay Area commuters who use that bridge regularly probably couldn't tell the difference

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[–] ReiRose@lemmy.world 18 points 7 months ago (7 children)

Is this comments section: "fuck shit up, society isn't working," vs "follow the rules when you protest, that's how you make change happen."

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