this post was submitted on 07 Oct 2023
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Im seing a bunch of things about israel right now, im out of the loop on this. Can somebody fill me in on what (if anything) happened?
Hamas launched a bunch of rockets from Gaza in a surprise attack on a holy day and then put ground fores in. This attack killed at least 100 Israeli civilians (Israel is also claiming near 1000 more injured) and has captured more.
Israel is of course going to retaliate and try and destroy the sites (surrounded by civilians since Hamas is known to try and use sensitive civilian locations as shields) and probably occupy Gaza in an effort to keep these rocket attacks from happening. Which will cause more Palestinian casualties, thus the cycle continues.
Israeli already killed more than 200 civillians in Gaza including bombing a hospital killing at least one international MFS medic.
I can assure you, that is a far lower number than have really died.
To be fair, they were very open about intentions to bomb Gazza from the first moment war was declared. PM called for civilians to evacuate to city.
and evacuate to where? Gaza is an open air prison with a population density of 6000 people/km2. The densely populated western european countries have about 300-500
Yeah that is utter bullshit from him! He knows very well that the people have nowhere to go! The Gaza strip is one of the most densely populated places on the planet. Israel controls the majority of the border and all of the sea. So those routes are closed. And you can bet your ass that Egypt won't allow 2 million Refugees passing their small part of the border.
Anyone who states that the civilians of the Gaza strip can just "leave the city" are either very uninformed or lying.
I mean seriously, just open Google maps and look at it. The area is very thin, 5-12km from the border to the sea and pretty much all city. And you can also bet that Israel for certain won't allow refugees to hide in the open area in front of the border.
Turkey hosts 10+ million, what's stopping Egypt here? They also openly support Palestine afaik.
Expecting Egypt to act is more realistic than expecting Israel to return fire.
Egypt and a lot of neighbouring countries talk a lot how they "support" Palestine but all of them really don't come through.
Egypt certainly doesn't want them self to get into the same problem Lebanon is facing with just half a million Palestinian refugees.
as long as you are honest about it, no war crime..
What do you expect them to do? Hamas is currently bombing Tel Aviv, no?
That's war isn't it?
Fuck that sounds awfull.
Thanks m8.
I posted these links in response to another comment that claimed that Israel wasn’t and hasn’t been the aggressor.
This wasn’t a “surprise”. Israel has been pushing their fucking luck over and over for the past few months and finally got bit.
https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2023/4/8/israel-is-creating-an-explosive-situation-in-al-aqsa
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/4/15/israeli-forces-raid-al-aqsa-mosque-over-50-palestinians-injured
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/7/27/israels-far-right-minister-leads-incursion-of-al-aqsa-compound
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/5/5/israeli-forces-storm-al-aqsa-as-hundreds-of-settlers-gather
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/6/26/israel-approves-plans-for-thousands-of-illegal-settlement-homes
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/6/palestinian-killed-as-israeli-settlers-attack-west-bank-town-of-huwara
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/6/20/un-chief-tells-israel-to-halt-illegal-settlements-in-palestine
Hamas launched a surpise attack on Israel yesterday, invading by land air and sea.
They massacered over 300 people, injured thousands, and abducted tens more.
Some of the victims are soldiers, the vast majority are civilians.
They cut up, desecrated and paraded the bodies of Israelis in their streets while chanting and cheering.
They fired thousands of rockets indiscriminately on Israeli cities hoping to cause as many civilian casualties as possible.
There is place to criticize Israel and their crimes agains Palestinians. There is no place to condone Hamas.
Hamas are terrorsists, and it disgusts me to my core to see Lemmy cheer on these bloodthirsty ghouls.
If Israelis want to not get killed maybe they should stop illegally settling on their land???
So these people, who were born and raised in Israel and who know no other homes, should go... where, exactly?
Yeah. What you're arguing for is genocide.
Not a single tear for the Palestinian families torn apart or flat out murdered to house that person. Because violence is OK when its on your side.
Nice deflection. Doesn't change the fact that you're supporting genocide though.
It's not genocide, and little details are knows as to why they were killed. The ones struck by rockets are the casualties of war, just like Russian citizens who annexed The Krim (or were born there) could die there if Ukraine is fighting to take the land back.
I don't know how it went down on the streets. Shooting on fleeing citizens is still a no-go in respect to the Geneva Convention (Palestine has agreed to all terms, Israel has not 1), which is unlikely given the low number of deaths on the Israeli side, versus the Palestinian side [2].
It would seem likely that the additional deaths were of civilians who were attacking those taking part in the conflict, which revokes them of the protections granted to civilians.
It's a complicated conflict, and I'm just making assumptions (as are you), but comparing casualties on both sides and hearing the atrocious stories of the Israeli government beating down innocent Palestines on their own grounds, does give me a tendancy to lean towards Palestine more.
[2]: see sibling post.
That's a great long grouping of words to say "I didn't do enough research".
Those bodies in tents at the rave sure looked like they were trying to fight back spread eagle on the ground with bullet holes in their backs.
Charming. And another deflection. You know exactly that I'm referring to you supporting Hamas being allowed to carry out the genocide they continually and explicitly call for.
you seem to want to conveniently ignore that there is plenty of evidence that Israel is equally genocidal in their actions and words.
If Israel had decided that they wanted a genocide of the Arab peoples in the Palestine area, there would not be any Arabs living there. Instead some 30% of Israeli citizens are ethnically Arab and the populations in the W.B and Gaza are constantly growing.
The IDF usually goes to a lot of effort to avoid unneccessary civilian casualties and the state of Israel goes to a lot of effort to maintain standards of living for Arabs in independent Gaza and the W.B autonomous areas.
In fact, I might even say that Israel cares more about the lives of civilians in the Gaza strip than Hamas does.
Controversial.
Hamas launched a whole bunch of rockets at Israeli civilians and killed many. Israel declared war as a result. Situation still ongoing
Dude, it's a fucking ground invasion. They are murdering civilians in their homes and kidnapping Israeli citizens into the Gaza strip
Oh no they're invading their own land. Bastards!
Invasion is a bit over the top. It is a few thousand fighters with no chance to reconquer any territory. It is an incursion at best.
"special operation"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasion
Neither can Hamas field large numbers, nor is Israel a similiar entity, as it is an established nation state with a well armed military, nor is the goal to conquer or establish authority over the areas attacked. The only criterium that is fullfilled is the "gaining concessions" part.
And comparing this to the russian invasion of Ukraine is just silly. Or did i miss the videos of kilometre long convoys driving onto Jerusalem, and hundreds of aircrafts launching from Gaza? I've seen some videos of guys in a motorized paraglider. But you dont want to really consider that equal to a fighter jet or attack helicopter do you?
I love that two words triggered tf out of you
Terrorist attacks. They attacked a rave with young people just there for music. The strength, size, and surprise of the attack is akin to a 9/11 or a pearl harbor for the Israeli.
It's still more monstrous that anything Isreal have done.., and boy oh boy they've done things.
I've seen way too many photos and videos in the past day. I've seen a women got shot in her car from the outside. Her baby was executed on the back seat. Mind you, the religion they believe in absolutely prohibits this.
I've seen the video of the Israeli soldiers lifeless bodies getting beaten and limbs getting cut off. I've seen soldier bodies getting loaded on to jeeps, pickups or even a guy carrying a body with a scooter.
I saw the video of an Israeli woman taken hostage, with her crotch are having blood(?) stains.
I've seen the pictures of women that were taken hostage and their relatives looking for them in Facebook. (Technically, Islam don't prohibit female hostages to be used as sex slaves, but I might be wrong on that).
I even saw the German girl they've murdered, strip and carry the body around with a pickup.
On the other side, the worst thing Israelis did were to strip down and reverse hand cuffed bunch of Hamas people. Also numbering them with paint.
Both sides are bad but holy fuck, seeing what Hamas have done in the course of a single day.., Isrealis look like they're good guys (which they definitely aren't, btw).
I looked for footage and i have seen none of these. Also saying the worst Israel did was handcuff some people is full of bullshit, when there is videos of them bombing hospitals and NGOs like MFS reporting their doctors killed. Oh and of course there is the constant killing of Palestinians over the years, like the murder of a journalist last year.
It's MSF, Médecins Sans Frontiers.
To correct myself, worst I've seen today would be a much better sentence.
Hamas did exactly the same this time, so they're now the same shit in different colors.
This is true, but it's still much more humane than stripping down a dead body and carry it around the world to see. One is shitty, other one is straight up barbaric.
This video is a great example, even though it's not the longest of specific scene you could find. Turns out she was a German citizen, a tattoo artist, only half Israeli. She was there to attend to a festival for the peace in Gazza.
It was not a "festival for the peace in Gaza". That was a statement by CNN from an undisclosed source, also known as a lie, and has since been deleted. Just letting you know.
Thanks.