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"Don't trust your lying eyes."
Stop gaslighting us. We saw him do it. Not once, but twice. And it's not like it happened in a vacuum either. He's been sucking up to fascists for a long time. He's also promoting the AfD in Germany. He's a fascist and everyone knows it. His Hitler Salutes aren't what made us believe he's a fascist. It just kind of served as extra verification of what we already knew.
"I've been calling everyone I don't like a Nazi for the last 10+ years and if I keep saying it all the time it must be true!"
There is a reason nobody takes y'all seriously.
You go ahead and continue insisting that everyone is a Nazi because they don't think exactly like you. Just keep driving moderates who were on your side away.
The ideological purity of the left/Dems is exactly how they lost and have continued to lose. But go ahead and keep hiding yourselves into hiveminds and echo chambers while booting anyone that even dares to question anything.
Wonderful strawman that doesn't address his point.
What point would that be exactly? That "He's a fascist and everyone knows it"?
There is quite literally nothing I could say to any of you that would make you realize how far up your own ass tour noggin is.
If anything the real idiot in this situation is me for bothering to try talking to people who were never going to change their thinking in a million years anyway.
Enjoy being angry and never winning an election again in your lives. Just keeeeeep pushing anyone away that isn't perfect like you. The middle and right are really enjoying all the new members you are giving them.
If you keep it up long enough maybe we can get a third party rolling for those of us who think that the left and the right both need to chill the fuck out in several major ways.
Genuine question, what would it actually take for you to concede that Elon Musk is a fascist? He's done everything short of literally stating aloud "I am a fascist." They used to maintain plausible deniability, and devoid of context Elon's salute might still have it, but in light of everything he says and does I would say that deniability is very implausible at this point.
Can you give me some examples of his fascist behaviors? He's done a lot of shit I don't like but mostly I just find him to be a conniving little shit. He's a hypocrite. He's a liar. Hes pathetic.
I'
Unbanning Neo-Nazis after buying Twitter under the guise of free speech and responding to the things they say with things like "I agree with this!" or "You're exactly right!"
Increasing censorship of left-wing speech while reducing or eliminating censorship of right-wing speech on his platform.
Promoting "white genocide" and "great replacement" conspiracy theories.
There's also the matter of his family background as slave-owning emerald mine tycoons in apartheid South Africa. His father, who is openly fascist, has stated publicly that he's proud that his son is "finally embracing his heritage."
Most damning of all is his cozying up to Trump, who ran on a platform of scapegoating minorities, allying government with the ultra rich, authoritarian concentration of power, hyper-nationalism, and imperialist expansionism.
People use the term Nazi as shorthand for fascist, but it is only one flavor of fascism. Fascism inevitably takes on a slightly different character and aesthetic in different places and times, but the parallels are undeniable.
Is it just that you don't understand what a Nazi is?
Do you mean the literal definition of a Nazi which is a person who is a member of the far-right national Socialist German Workers' Party?
Do you mean the sorta slang definition where someone is so strict about something that they will only allow it to be done their way an no ther other way (think grammar Nazi)?
Because last time I checked Elon is not a member of the far-right national socialist German workers party.
And whether or not hes the slang type of Nazi seems like it's probably not what you're talking about, but I'm guessing you could make that argument based on him instantly banning people he didn't like off Twitter.
Nazis are a very specific thing. The term you and everyone else should be using is probably fascist. And to be fair many are calling him both.
Remember all Nazis are Fascists, but not all Fascists are Nazis.
I don't at all agree with your defense or lack of acknowledgement that his behavior is mirrors that of actual 1930s/40s Nazis.
I will say the distinction you made is accurate, it would be more accurate if we called him a fascist. Well at least partially, because you don't have to do a Nazi salute to be a fascist*, but you do if you're a Nazi.
But you noticed how you used grammar Nazi down there? You just established that people have taken the term that used to apply only to the actual 130s/40s Nazis, but has since taken on new meaning.
The same argument can be made about hook and loop fasteners, so far Velcro was the most famous for it. It doesn't mean that I'm wrong when I call off brand hook and loop fasteners 'velcro'. That's just what everyone knows it as, which gives the words their meaning, not the other way around.
Enough of the world population has used the term Nazi in the exact context that you seem to despise, and that's enough for me and likely us.
Show me the difference then between a Nazi salute and what Elon did Make a video and post it u complete pussy.
Yeah I'm not gonna do that. I don't give away that kind of specific information on the Internet. I've had stalkers show up at my place of work and house in the past. I learned that lesson ages ago. Y'all are little psychos sometimes.
I know you won't watch it and you're gonna lose your mind simply because it's a link to a service you despise but here's a video of a guy who is autistic himself and has an even more autistic son talking about it and doing the same motion as Elon several times for emphasis: https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT2LY2vuR/
I'm gonna preemptively assume that you will refuse to watch the video or you'll watch the video and listen to exactly zero of what he said just to come back here to triple down on your shit take.
If that's the case I'm just gonna move on and I wish you the best.
I'll make it a little easier on you.
I'll even give you a headstart, the difference I can spot is that Elon had more enthusiasm about it than Hitler did.
I know you aren't actually asking in ernest, but I'm burning time until I'm off work so I'll play your game.
Open hand with fingers spread across heart vs closed fingers all touching held almost vertically at sternum.
Palm slight tilted back at the end (as the intent is to be giving out his heart) vs palm level with the ground (and sometimes angled slightly down even) at full extension.
A gap between his thumb and the rest of his fingers vs thumb against index finger with tip bent inward and under Palm slightly.
Nazi salute is done with a straight back and no torso motion. Musk leaned back as if to really throw that heart out to the people at the very back.
Then of course there is the context of the words being said by the speaker. Musk was thanking people and saying "my heart goes out to you" as he does the motion. A phrase he's used in the past, but also a phrase (and motion) used by others in the past: https://youtu.be/f6lsWl9o0-g
And before you even say anything yes walz is doing a MUCH better job of it. Very clearly keeping the elbow slightly bent and the palm facing clearly outward with fingers spread. Elon has always been an awkward guy. Hes got a strange gait and posture. He jumped around like a child behind Trump a few months back.
Did this argument work or did you get bored? Asking for a friend
So you're willing to excuse the action as a whole with that tiktok video you posted as being awkward, but that same argument cant be applied to degree in which his palm is facing?
With logic, it has to work both ways, you can't just pick the one you like most and call it a day.
Also what he said after was sloppy/obvious cleanup. Someone else said it better than I, but he didn't do this in a vacuum, his spiral into far right politics has been front and center and we've been staring at it everyday in the news.
Also I did come at you like an asshole, I shouldn't have done that.
Bla bla strawman bla bla. I don't think everyone is a Nazi. I think Nazis are Nazis, and Hitler Salutes are things Nazis do. Elon did Nazi Salutes and he sucks up to fascists.. It's not my fault that you think doing Nazi shit does not make someone a Nazi.
Anyway, hating Nazis is ideological purity now? Then I guess I'm an ideological purist.