771
Italy investigates Placebo singer for calling far-right PM ‘racist’ and ‘fascist’
(www.theguardian.com)
this post was submitted on 19 Jul 2023
771 points (97.5% liked)
World News
39110 readers
3224 users here now
A community for discussing events around the World
Rules:
-
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
- Post news articles only
- Video links are NOT articles and will be removed.
- Title must match the article headline
- Not United States Internal News
- Recent (Past 30 Days)
- Screenshots/links to other social media sites (Twitter/X/Facebook/Youtube/reddit, etc.) are explicitly forbidden, as are link shorteners.
-
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
-
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
-
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
-
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
-
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
-
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
-
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
Lemmy World Partners
News !news@lemmy.world
Politics !politics@lemmy.world
World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world
Recommendations
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
- Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Fascist admirers of Mussolini would usually qualify as far right:
Who is Giorgia Meloni? The rise to power of Italy's new far-right PM
Thank you. People seriously need to stop acting like words don't have meaning and it's impossible for actual fascists to actually exist.
"But whatabout teh mom & pop shops!" was from day 1 a deliberate talking point that existed to delegitimize the very legitimate protests. Do you really think none of the Tea Party contemporaries said the exact same thing about them? "Whatabout those poor sailors who carried that tea who are losing their payday and had nothing to do with the Stamp Act? Whatabout the poor local community merchants who will lose out on all those tea sales now? The Stamp Act is not their fault." Do you really think none of the loyalists were saying that?
We need to face the fact that we have a class of American citizens who continue to suffer under an oppressive police state. Their protests are valid
Oh, going by the actual definition of fascism and calling fans of Mussolini fascist? How very fascist of you!
It's possible they're getting hung up on the fact that you are using the western, dumbed down Fisher-Price version of the political spectrum where both sides are capitalism.
The actual political plot is a two-dimensional thing. Where left and right is defined by capitalism and socialism only. With a separate axis completely for social issues. Meaning that neo-libertarians, capitalists that favor social democracy, and authoritarians/fascist can all be equally far right. Likewise Authoritarian Leninists, social democracy favoring socialist/communist, true libertarian, and anarchist can all be equally far left. Despite all of them differing wildly on social issues.
Though I definitely could be wrong and they could just be apologizing for fascist. Sometimes it's hard to tell.
Nothing is binary. Well outside of binary of course. Sometimes we can loosely quantize stuff in a useful manner with it but that doesn't make things binary. Human gender and sex is not binary for example.
Being authoritarian does not negate socialism or capitalism. If authoritarian states like China can be socialist. Authoritarian states like the KSA and USA can be capitalist. This is not a hard concept.
Now it would be accurate to qualify that they are authoritarian first and economic system second. When it comes to authoritarian rule priorities are their wealth and power. Everyone and everything else comes second. They can straddle left and right easily. But that does not negate or abolish concepts of capitalism or socialism.
Because it's laughably wrong and misguided. By that definition no center can exist. Which is obviously and observably patently wrong in every sense.
Also left is not defined as communism. Left is defined as socialism. Communism especially big C communism or ML is an authoritarian socialist ideology. There are also non authoritarian socialist ideologies. Including other forms of non-state communism. I understand your misconceptions. Believe me as an American and someone raised in the west myself. We are all purposely miseducated on them. But no matter how comfortable it is. It is still incorrect and misinformation.
For example let's refer to a few of the ideologies that I mentioned before liberalism, Democratic socialist, and social Democrats. Democratic socialist exist and are pretty centrist. By your definition they do not exist. Yet they do exist. Social Democrats are to the left of Democratic socialists. But they are generally against ML communists. Which by your definition makes them not left. But social Democrats are also generally against capitalism. This does not make them fit under your left or right spectrum. This simply marks a gap in your understanding. And nothing more. Because they are solidly socialist. I hope this can help clear up the confusion for you.
I'm literally not using a binary. I don't know how many different times and how many different ways I have to state this. I literally said it's not a binary. You are the one using the binary. You are the one that's claiming centers cannot exist. When in truth the center is the only thing we really know absolutely exists. It's the extents and the fringes that we are not 100% sure about. And just because something is center or centrist does not necessarily mean that it's good. Nothing about what I'm saying isn't eurocentric. It's just not US centric.
From your article, "Yes to the natural family, no to the LGBT lobby, yes to sexual identity, no to gender ideology... no to Islamist violence, yes to secure borders, no to mass migration... no to big international finance... no to the bureaucrats of Brussels!"
So Western European far right,so centrist or even left wing everywhere else.
It also seems shes distanced herself from fascists.
Seems she just wants closed borders? Am i missing something? Theres a couple articles that claim stuff, but with zero quotes to back it up.
Anti LGBT, white supremacist, antisemitic. She also openly praised Mussolini when she was young and her party used fascist imagery. But when she had a vote of no confidence against her she said she's not a fascist so it's all good!