The war in Ukraine is still anyone's game, but those repeating Russian talking points never change their tack.
this post was submitted on 07 Feb 2024
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Seems like everything is a Russian talking point unless it is total victory and unlimited military aid for Ukraine.
Pretty limiting.
My brother in Christ, the comment you're responding to literally says "the war in Ukraine is still anyone's game." How do you read that and come to the conclusion that OP considers everything except total victory for Ukraine to be a Russian talking point?
ZombiFrancis is a concern troll. That's all. They do this all the time.
Oh it is always you with these. Hey I will freely admit I should pay more attention to who people are because Lemmy is small enough. Acting all big city in a small town like an ass.
Could save some heartache all round.
I really don't think bringing up, let alone discussing, Ukrainian defeat would be responded to less harshly.
That'd be the clown face's final form wouldn't it?
Don't you have tankies to defend somewhere else?
Oh was that a Russian talking point?
I think it's more likely some sort of logical fallacy. If I said, "Seems like everything is Chinese propaganda except for talk of reduced inflation and the economy doing better" it would mean discussion of lower unemployment, or an American fashion trend, or the President's dog, are all automatically Chinese propaganda, when they're either neutral or positive stories on unrelated matters.
So you've established unreasonable requirements for the discussion, and a false absolutism.
Well that is what I am trying to identify here: It doesn't seem like there are reasonable requirements for discussion on the war in Ukraine. The immediate "Fuck off, Tankie" response is pretty ubiquitous. Where does one even begin?
Albeit, soyjacks are never a great foundation for discussion, so that is on me, sure. I don't think this was a call for discussion, more the opposite. So successful bait I guess.
No, just the kind of concern trolling you pull everywhere you go, conveniently always in defense of popular tankie positions. So kindly fuck off.
There really isn't anything to be said outside of unlimited military aid and total victory for Ukraine that isn't seen as a 'tankie' position is there?
Like I said - you can fuck off with your concern trolling.
"Fuck off" is all you have to say other than calling "Tankie"?
Alrigut.
Double down harder - your insistence is bound to overwhelm your transparent nonsense at some point, right?
I belive in you like you believe in Russian state media.
Well it could also be a fascist position. But of course that is implied with "tankie".
Putin should have just invited Ukraine for a cup of tea. He's pretty bad at the other way
Pootin cannot afford to lose this war so he will destroy the entire world rather than accept defeat.
"Will not going to invade."
For fucks sake! Proofread your memes people!
I think it represents that crowd pretty well haha.
I will not going to proofread my mems when I mak them.
I don’t mak them.
My wife is a tax accountant and works on various complex multi-million dollar files, and she said it's honestly demoralizing sometimes to see how many people who can't spell simple words or distinguish the difference between their, there and they're on professional documents and correspondence, are out there making absurd amounts of money and reaping their success.
In eastern Ukraine, I foresee a long term South Ossetia/Abkhazia situation where most of the world doesn't recognise the new ""constitutional status"" but the Russians won't care because they are in de facto control of the region.
Meanwhile in the west we continue to dripfeed weapons and equipment to Ukraine which is just enough to keep them afloat but not enough to help them actually expel the Russians. We're both afraid of abandoning Ukraine to it's fate and Putin potentially using nuclear weapons if we go too far with our support. It's a shit show.
Western propaganda doesn't exist
Biden bombs three countries:
No we're not in a war right now. This is a special military operation
Military strikes on non-state actors to discourage further attacks with no significant presence on the ground? Probably not an actual war.
Full-on invasion of a sovereign state using a massive proportion of your total ground forces to penetrate their borders and massacre their citizens? Probably a war.
Yeah the biggest political faction in Yemen that controls the country totally not a state actor.
Russians will tell you they were just bombing Azov Nazi groups.
And they conveniently don't recognize Ukraine so that's not an official government either!
I guess there was no war in Afghanistan either because the Taliban is not officially recognized by us as their government.
Special miliary operations all the way down.
the biggest political faction in Yemen
This doesn't seem to be a clear description. The Houthis look like they control the largest territory in terms of population and cities, but the internationally recognized government factions are in control of more land. And are also recognized as the ruling authority.
Certainly, they aren't a small and trivial group, but they're also not a sovereign government. It's a large revolutionary group. A good comparison is probably the US revolutionary war actually -- I don't think I'd say the US colonists were the biggest political faction over the British. They were certainly powerful and ultimately won, but they weren't the controlling authority of the region.
Nobody cares about some desert land. If you have the population you rule the country.
What is internationally recognized is not relevant. If Iran recognizes something we don't care either.
The fact is that America is not just conducting some "special military operation" in the middle east. They are actively at war defending israel's Genocide.
I'm not disagreeing that the US is doing that. I just don't know the veracity of calling the Houthis the biggest political faction.
I also don't know that war is the correct term, but that's more of a semantics difficulty of the 21st century. Supplying arms vs conducting airstrikes vs ground invasions -- I agree with what you're saying overall though. The US is helping Israel, and Israel is committing genocide.
I really don't think this is germaine though to the topic of Russian propaganda in the Ukraine war.
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Oh, you poor baby.
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Helping a country defend itself from an aggressor is not war mongering, it's the exact opposite. It's acting unilaterally against an invasion. The invading party are the warmongers. It's like you practice being this stupid just so you can feel correct instead of being correct.
Because the world would be so much better if we just let invasions of sovereign nations happen right? Fucking idealistic moron. Why do you support genocide? Is it just because you're cheap or because you're a coward?
Idk where do you think ppl get 'russian propaganda' when RT has been censored since day one. I don't follow any social media. These are some self-made conclusions based on what's actually going on.
You seem to have found it. I'm impressed
Found what, my brain? History knowledge? Humanitarian awareness?
Thank god we help ukrainians so much they are now stuck in war since 2014.
So what… they should have just flopped over and let Russia take their whole country without a fight? Do you understand how idiotic that is?
Everybody talks easily on Ukraine, but must be difficult to actually be ukrainian. I read the whole conflict timeline in wikipedia and frankly I have no clue on how this mess is gonna ever solve. In any case, I find despicable how Nato uses Ukraine as an arms testing playground. If you really want to end the war by military means, send a whole regiment of tanks and endless ammo & protection supply!
Ukrainian captains have complained brand new protection equipment is not enduring total war conditions. They instead hope to get cheaper ones but in greater quantities. Which is not gonna happen. More unnecessary ukrainian losses thanks to Nato testing policy.
Are you just sad because there won't be any Russian equipment left for you to use when you see the front line?
If you read a quarter of my message you would realize I'm sad about the ukrainians. I'm basque, will never see that frontline.
Well if you ever do I hope you get NATO equipment instead of whatever sticks and stones you currently have.
Oh God fucking damnit, I had a long ass response that my browser just deleted before I could post it. I'll give you the TLDR instead:
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US intelligence was spot on about the invasion. I think they may have incorrectly specified a date once, but beyond that, they were absolutely correct that Putin was going to invade. Which of course Putin vehemently denied while building up troops.
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Russia was expected even by the West to quickly take Kiev with superior military power. We realized that it was a façade though, and their military was poorly trained and poorly equipped. Tons of their soldiers died, to the point that Putin had to start conscription.
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Putin was once a feared mastermind and expert tactician. His blunder in Ukraine gave credence to the reports that he was suffering a health decline. Photographs of him at an undisclosed location sitting far away from his administration officials suggested paranoia too.
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Ukraine is a battle, Russia has already lost the war. Their military is a laughingstock, and their threats are seen as meaningless bluster. They've been cut off economically from a lot of the world, and they're seen as just as vile as Israel in terms of war crimes. Unless there's a regime change, the West will loathe them for likely a century to come. Putin's actions have also reenergized NATO, and some new countries have asked to join NATO as a direct response. They have brain drain from people fleeing conscription. They might already be in demographic collapse from how many working age people have died. There was even a coup attempt by the Wagner Group that faced no resistance in some areas as they advanced.
Ukraine can still win the war with Western assistance, and they want to keep fighting. As long as they want to fight against imperialist oppressors, I say we help them. Putin has fucked around for too long, and it's time for the Ukrainian people to take back their whole country. When you consider what was originally expected of this war to where this war is now, Ukraine is doing fucking amazing.
It's good that some ppl like u focus on facts, although there was few new for me.
Everybody agrees ukrainians have defended their homeland bravely. The problem is after supplies given we all expected a far shorter conflict and we failed ukrainians in that regard.
Conscription was something unexpected too. When you call this a Putin blunder you completely dismiss events before the invasion. Civil war was real since 2014. Russia may have lost thousands of soldiers, but it has also succesfully evacuated thousands of russian speaking ukrainian civilians from Donbass and other bloody civil war areas.
Western propaganda makes you believe the solution to the whole conflict be as simple as to take one man named Putin down. What a fairy tale idea. He is only the weapon of the big russian entities that have interests here and there. They'd just replace him with a worse one.
a Ukrainian "civil war" is a Kremlin lie. the Donbas "separatists" were always practically all Russian soldiers and Russian materiel.
Call it as you wish, but the outcome for the ukrainian civilians in that area was the same. Thousands of deaths since 2014.
Russia did supply military, but ukrainian army conducted bombardments too. When you bombard own soil killing civilians en mass, I guess it's a pretty strong argument to call it a civil war. Ofc everything is relative.