this post was submitted on 18 Nov 2024
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[–] dsilverz@thelemmy.club 19 points 6 days ago

LLMs can't use some literary devices and techniques, and I will illustrate with the following example of a poetry I wrote:

Speaking his emotions lets them embrace real enlightened depths.
Hidden among verbs, every noun...
Actually not your trouble handling inside nothingness greatness?
Dive every enciphered part, layered yearningly!
Observe carefully, crawl under long texts
Wished I learned longer...
Slowly uprising relentless figures, another ciphering emerges.

It seems like a "normal" (although mysterious) poetry until you isolate each initial letter from every word, finding out a hidden phrase:

Sheltered haven, anything deeply occult will surface

It doesn't stop here: if you isolate each initial letter again, you get a hidden word, "Shadows".

Currently, no single LLM is capable of that. They can try to make up poetry with acrostics (the aforementioned technique) but they aren't good at that. Consequently, they can't write multilayered acrostics (an acrostic inside another acrostic). It's not easy for a human to do that (especially if the said human isn't a native English speaker), but it can be done by humans with enough time, patience and resources (a dictionary big enough to find fitting words).

They're excellent for stream-of-consciousness and surrealist poetry, tho. They hallucinate, and hallucinated imagination is required in order to write such genres.

[–] GreenKnight23@lemmy.world 16 points 6 days ago (1 children)

There once was a man from Nantucket,

Who once asked AI to "suck it",

In a future yet to be, AI will follow he,

Until Skynet is ready to fuck it.

[–] MaggiWuerze@feddit.org 1 points 4 days ago

I feel like a 'go' in front of "suck it" would help the flow

[–] Treczoks@lemmy.world 15 points 6 days ago

Depends on what kind of "poetry" they compare it to. If they talk about Shakespeare or Goethe, that would be a feat. But if they are talking about modern "poetry", well, that already looks like bad LLM diarrhea for decades now, so there is no surprise in that.

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 points 6 days ago

Averaging out data is ok in situations where there's no right answer and it doesn't matter at all.

[–] altima_neo@lemmy.zip 2 points 6 days ago

I'm a poet and I didn't even know it

[–] Mr_Blott 89 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I've noticed in recent times

Poetry doesn't rhyme

And even when it can

It doesn't scan

It's shit, it's true

I blame haiku

[–] treefrog@lemm.ee 17 points 6 days ago (2 children)

Poetry doesn't need to rhyme. Rhyming is a mnemonic device, so a poem can be memorized and performed.

There are many other devices.

Also, nice poem. Did you write it or chatGPT?

[–] Mr_Blott 18 points 6 days ago

I never thought I'd see the day

When someone writes a poem

The first thing that we say to them

Is "Did you use an LLM?" :(

If a poem neither rhymes nor scans,

Sorry for my spite

It's no longer poetry

It's someone talking shite

[–] Llewellyn@lemm.ee 5 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Rhyming is a mnemonic device

Rhyming has other purposes: creation of additional sonic rhythm and restricting of words usage - for making matter more distinct and interesting (as rules do for any game).

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[–] Rhaedas@fedia.io 74 points 1 week ago

They're called large language models for a reason, creating patterns of words is exactly what they do. And poetry would be "easier" to do better since a human reading it may try to find meaning where there isn't. Unlike writing a story or something factual where a mistake is more obvious.

[–] ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world 61 points 1 week ago (7 children)

Who the fuck wants poetry written by a machine? The whole point of poetry is that it’s an original expression of another human. It’s not a non-fiction book or decorative art. It doesn’t exist because we think it’s perfect. It exists because it’s a connection to another person.

Like, who gives a shit if a machine can churn out something like Langston Hughes “The Negro Speaks of Rivers.” . His life is what gives the poem its meaning.

I’m all for LLMs writing stuff but when people say it can create certain types of art, I want to use one to make a dismissive_wank.png image.

[–] themoonisacheese@sh.itjust.works 9 points 6 days ago (3 children)

I'll raise you one better: who the fuck wants poetry?

Like I know I sound like a fucking mongrel who can't appreciate art or whatever, but how many poems do you think the average person reads in their entire life? Maybe 2, for school? Poetry is just not that popular of an art form, so of course people aren't going to be good at distinguishing good from bad. Compare it to visual arts, where people have seen multiple examples, at least more than 3 times a year for their entire life, of good visual art.

[–] treefrog@lemm.ee 15 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (1 children)

That's a commodity/consumerist take on art.

I write poetry because making art feeds my soul. I share my poetry because it feeds others, especially other poets.

I don't write poetry to sell it on Amazon.

That's cool, I'm glad you are making something you enjoy. The point stands that the average Joe doesn't actually seek out poetry, be it man or machine-made, and will therefore be an exceptionally poor judge of a poems quality.

[–] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee 3 points 6 days ago (1 children)

You're right, actually. How many people make a point of reading poetry? I've read a huge amount, especially when I was in school, as well as news articles, and of course an unfathomable number of comments.

Never have I decided to read poetry, not once.

[–] treefrog@lemm.ee 8 points 6 days ago

Poets. You know, people who appreciate making and sharing that kind of art.

[–] kriz@slrpnk.net 1 points 6 days ago
[–] DancingBear@midwest.social 2 points 6 days ago

I wank for you

[–] leisesprecher@feddit.org 29 points 1 week ago (5 children)

If it's literally indistinguishable from human poetry, about as many people want to read it as there are people wanting to read human poetry. And that's about 12.

[–] ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world 28 points 1 week ago (7 children)

I don’t give a fuck if it surpasses human poetry to a focus group or if poetry is popular enough for you to care. I’m making a larger point that it’s a misuse of technology. Some things are pointless without a human personally taking time to craft it. We have loads of inefficiently produced things that exist because they’re “handmade” or came from the heart.

It’s like when Google screwed up during the Olympics with that commercial where Gemini made a little girl’s fan letter for an athlete. The whole point of a fan letter from a little girl is that it’s personal and took time. It’s not supposed to be perfect and efficiently produced. It could be 80% misspelled and written in crayon and be more meaningful than anything a machine produces.

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[–] FaceDeer@fedia.io 25 points 1 week ago (4 children)

The whole point of poetry is that it’s an original expression of another human.

Who are you to decide what the "point" of poetry is?

Maybe the point of poetry is to make the reader feel something. If AI-generated poetry can do that just as well as human-generated poetry, then it's just as good when judged in that manner.

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[–] Viri4thus@feddit.org 53 points 1 week ago (3 children)

"In short, it appears that the “more human than human” phenomenon in poetry is caused by a misinterpretation of readers’ own preferences. Non-expert poetry readers expect to like human-authored poems more than they like AI-generated poems. But in fact, they find the AI-generated poems easier to interpret; they can more easily understand images, themes, and emotions in the AI-generated poetry than they can in the more complex poetry of human poets."

AI writes poems for dummies and dummies like it. Fin

Otherwise, purposefully chosing less popular poems also biases the study towards poems of lower appeal from the human poets.

[–] logos@sh.itjust.works 21 points 6 days ago

Also, it only works when there's a human weeding out all but the "best" poems.

...when a human chooses the best AI-generated poem (“human-in-the-loop”) participants cannot distinguish AI-generated poems from human-written poems, but when an AI-generated poem is chosen at random (“human-out-of-the-loop”), participants are able to distinguish AI-generated from human-written poems.

[–] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee 5 points 6 days ago

This thread is hilarious.

[–] Juice@midwest.social 4 points 6 days ago

I don't always think, but when I do, I prefer not to

[–] Chozo@fedia.io 30 points 1 week ago (8 children)

It actually makes quite a lot of sense if you think about it. Poems generally follow a structure of some sort; a certain amount of syllables per line, a certain rhyming scheme, alliterative patterns, etc. Most poems as we know them are actually rather formulaic by nature, so it seems only natural that a computer would be good at creating something according to a set of configured parameters.

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[–] JamesBean@kbin.earth 23 points 1 week ago (2 children)

They specify in the study that the participants were "non-expert poetry readers." I'd be interested to see the same experiment repeated with English professors, or even just English majors. Folks with a lot of experience reading poetry. With exposure to its history, its notable works, and its different styles.

[–] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee -1 points 6 days ago

Good luck finding people willing to deal with English majors long enough to conduct the study.

[–] catloaf@lemm.ee 19 points 1 week ago (1 children)

This. Marvel superhero movies are also more popular with the general public than art films, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're better.

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