I'm honestly surprised they're still updating Java edition
this post was submitted on 01 Apr 2024
671 points (96.1% liked)
Gaming
20079 readers
63 users here now
Sub for any gaming related content!
Rules:
- 1: No spam or advertising. This basically means no linking to your own content on blogs, YouTube, Twitch, etc.
- 2: No bigotry or gatekeeping. This should be obvious, but neither of those things will be tolerated. This goes for linked content too; if the site has some heavy "anti-woke" energy, you probably shouldn't be posting it here.
- 3: No untagged game spoilers. If the game was recently released or not released at all yet, use the Spoiler tag (the little ⚠️ button) in the body text, and avoid typing spoilers in the title. It should also be avoided to openly talk about major story spoilers, even in old games.
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
That's the version people actually play, and which has the furthest developed systems to do bigger stuff. Look up PaperMC, it enables some wild stuff for Minecraft multiplayer.
The server options available for multiplayer in Bedrock are truly pathetic in comparison.
I know. I've seen a lot of videos on the differences between Java and Bedrock, how Bedrock came to be, modding on Java like Feed The Beast, and multiplayer servers like 2BT2 (for those that don't know FitMC has some good vidoes on 2B2T; it's a neat rabbit hole to go down if you want to kill sometime).
What I am saying is I am surprised that Microsoft is still updating Java when there's so much money to be made nickle and diming players in Bedrock edition. Like paying for skins for example. It would definitely piss off a lot of the player base but I don't know if it would cause them to lose money in the long run. I imagine a lot of casual players are content using Bedrock and unaware of why Java is important.
Minecraft is already on the way out of the Zeitgeist of cultural relevance. The minecraft audience is mostly nostalgic grown ups now. Bedrock is kept alive by parents trying to have quality time with their kids on a safer or easier to maintain server space. The truly passionate and obsessed users, doing crazy and innovative stuff to their servers are still on Java edition. Kill Java and you kill Minecraft for all practical intents and purposes.
Kids are playing roblox now anyways.
I feel like Minecraft surges in popularity pretty regularly. As long as people continue streaming it and posting videos of it I think that'll remain the same. I don't know if someone who is looking for a taste of what they saw online will know the limitations of Bedrock. They might just pick it up because it's available on whatever platform they use.
I suppose killing Java might put a stop to the content that is being created with Minecraft and that might cause it lose its relevance but I don't know if a majority of content creators are using Java or Bedrock.
Streamers almost exclusively use Java. There are certain popular games and mods that are only possible and/or easier to setup on JE. Achievement Hunter was one of the rare channels that used the console version at first and even them changed to the JE eventually. But they are not relevant anymore, weren't for some time before their closure. Hyper massive servers, custom maps, automated gamerules with scripts, most of those things that make Minecraft creative and interesting to watch exist only on the JE.
load more comments
(2 replies)
load more comments
(6 replies)
Kids are all playing Bedrock on their Switches and iPads. Microsoft is just passing the long game.
Java is quite popular online due to all the mods and the videos people upload to YouTube using those mods, but I believe in terms of number of users, Bedrock outscores it quite a bit. The barrier to entry is lower – $7 on iOS/Android and most people have phones.
load more comments
(5 replies)
load more comments
(4 replies)
Genuine question: why does bedrock exist? What does it bring? Why is there the choice between java, bedrock and "Minecraft for windows"?
How do you fuck up this badly?
I tried using the launcher to move a java install from C: to another drive and it just points there and doesn't do anything? Steam had this stuff figured years ago
Minecraft rewritten for better performance with platform interoperability in mind and so on. Essentially what could've or should've been a replacement to Minecraft if done right. It was not done right. Quite the opposite.
In what world is c++ better for cross platform than Java?
In a world with consoles. Java needs a JVM, and those aren't typical with things like the Switch (2 soon), PS5, and Xbox Series (half the alphabet).
Oh ok that's fair enough. I forget those exist sometimes.
C++ is generally more performant than Java.
https://programming-language-benchmarks.vercel.app/java-vs-cpp
load more comments
(7 replies)
Good thing we have Minetest and Vintage Story!
Because Bedrock runs on phones, tablets, consoles, and a host of other random crap, and does so relatively well. Because of that the install base and playtime especially among younger players is actually massively skewed toward Bedrock being the more used. Add to that rumors that the Java codebase at least was a terrible mess, and the performance issues Java edition still has to this day and it's no wonder they wanted to do a full rewrite, especially after having to make things like the console editions and even one for the 3DS.
The windows launcher is annoying though.
Because Bedrock runs on phones, tablets, consoles, and a host of other random crap
And it also removes Linux support. Typical Microsoft.
To be fair there's a Linux version of the bedrock server. But yeah not having it on the steam deck is pretty annoying.
load more comments
(2 replies)
There's also the fact that Bedrock patches bugs that the Java community freaks out about patching. Several chunk update glitches and undesirable redstone behavior are exploited by the Java players, and they go nuts over the idea of fixing the issues. Bedrock, being a new codebase, obviously didn't port over old crusty bugs and therefore doesn't have to carry over those expectations.
To be fair I'd call it a wash. Bedrock fixes a lot of weird stuff like quasi connectivity and being able to push things like chests with pistons but also introduces it's own bugs like weird timing things and randomly taking fall damage. There's also weird differences like being able to do things with cauldrons or just like minor texture differences that they are slowly bringing into sync.
load more comments
(1 replies)
Also swapped performance issues with more bugs that were there years ago and still persist because they are almost impossible to fix.
In the end, we all know it was done either because they wanted to shove microtransactions down our throat and/or had some kind of deal to maintain the Java edition without microtransactions.
Or, maybe, just maybe, they though "it's just a block game, what could be so hard to rewrite it?" and absolutely failed what a single person got right almost immediately back in the day (like not falling through the floor all the time).
load more comments
(1 replies)
Java is a hilariously bad platform for games.
Only if you're incompetent. Otherwise just not optimal.
Starsector, Rise to Ruins and Project Zomboid run well and are made in Java for example. It's harder to pull off but it can be done. (still needs native libraries though)
load more comments
(5 replies)
load more comments
(4 replies)
Java > Bedrock
F*ck M$ for even making Bedrock...
It's an inferior version of Minecraft and it fractures the modding community.
its technically better.
microsoft just made it limited and stupid on purpose to make more money off it. which is more infuriating imo.
Yea, back in the day I dreamt about a Minecraft that didn’t run on Java and thus better on the low end hardware I had. In my dreams it just still had all the benefits of the Java edition which is why I now dream of old Java Minecraft
load more comments
(2 replies)
So just fuck everyone who doesn't play on Pc? There are aspects about bedrock that should be gotten rid of, but it's existence is for the ability for cross play to exist. I play both versions but bedrock made making a cross platform server for my friends and I (who all play on different consoles) possible.
load more comments
(3 replies)
Java has had mod support for like 7 years now.
Does it have official support though?
Edit: To be clear this comment was referencing what OP's post was likely trying to convey. Of course Minecraft has been moddable on Java for years but as the Minecraft help page says it isn't officially supported. I know about data packs and their support/limitations.
Yes. They're called datapacks.
"Oh! Those aren't mods!"
Well, they modify the game, so they're mods.
Yeah what I was asking about is official support in Java; that's probably what OP is referencing. I looked it up and the answer is no.
It's a bit like saying Skyrim didn't have mod support in 2011 when it released until 2017 when Creation Club content was added. Of course there were mods in 2011 but not officially supported ones.
Even though notch promised an sdk!
He says a lot of stuff, including a lot of stuff he shouldn't. Jokes aside, his intentions were made clear when he bought out Bukkit than proceeded to tear it apart for the crime of being a better server hosting software than the garbage they had. Pretty cut-and-dry.
For those paying attention that was the first hint the guy might be a little bit of a nazi before he went completely mask-off on twitter.
load more comments
(2 replies)
load more comments
(2 replies)
Also texture/resource packs are also technically mods, because you are modifying the game's resources and packs are officially supported.
load more comments
(1 replies)
"Mod Support" means (or at least, it used to) the game has structures in place to allow modifications, not that the company is paywalling mods that they "approve". I'm not sure what the latter is called, but I'm quite sure there'd be a massive uproar if MS/MJ did that for java edition. I know I'd never play the game again, that's for sure.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(2 replies)
Honestly I don't see the issue here java already supports mods and they didn't fuck with it and just added a way to do it for suckers as well
Agree. I just wish bedrock was a straight port from the java version instead of being borderline ruined, the only difference should have been better performance from not using java and it being rebuilt from ground up.
I still remember when the Java edition was supposed to get a modding API...
Microsoft and Mojang make a lot of stupid decisions. Or rather, asshole decisions. I'm tired of it all.
Here's some Minecraft communities on Lemmy
!minecraftseeds@sh.itjust.works
!oldschoolminecraft@lemmy.world
Also Minetest
load more comments
(3 replies)
Wouldnt it make more sense to add official mod support to bedrock than to java? Java already has unofficial modloaders and more people play on bedrock edition
The mods are shit too. I don't know what their API is like but it's clearly not good if you have this entire legacy of modded minecraft, a game which is (presumably) way better programmed and they're actively paying people to do it, yet they can barely accomplish a 10th of the quality.
Even if they were good you'd have to interact with that horse-shit mobile game premium currency model (which absolutely should be made illegal) where you have to buy currency in packs with bigger packs having a discount and are never in sizes that are usable for a single purchase. Having to pay for mods is contentious enough as is, but putting it behind abusive MTX is going to be a deal breaker for the rest.
load more comments
(2 replies)
they srill advertise java for modding even though there's no "official" support tho
Insert quip about minetest
Reminder that minetest (even with Mineclone 2) feels like "we have Minecraft at home" on a good day
view more: next ›