this post was submitted on 18 Sep 2023
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Serious question. I'm vaguely familiar with him as a political commentator on the left, but the more I see of the guy, the more I think he's just a liberal.

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[–] dannoffs@lemmy.sdf.org 98 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Classic "Non-Marxist Socialist" lol

[–] Poison_Ivy@hexbear.net 52 points 1 year ago (5 children)

The hell is a non-marxist socialist

Its like saying “meat based tofu”

[–] emizeko@hexbear.net 52 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

unscientific utopian socialism, the kind Engels is contrasting with in Socialism: Utopian and Scientific

https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1880/soc-utop/index.htm

[–] TreadOnMe@hexbear.net 40 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Arguably the most common kind of socialism in the 'west' historically. To go off of what @emizeko said, they were usually utopian socialists, particularly religious and nudist sects in the U.S., there is a whole sect of German utopians that set up around Missouri I think, but there were lots of these groups up south of Seattle, and even (famously) anarchist nudist socialists on the peninsula in Seattle.

They were non-Marxist in that they didn't subscribe to any variety of Marxist economic or geo-political thinking, and they usually are big on libertarian principles coming first.

[–] ElGosso@hexbear.net 19 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Nudist, you say? Maybe we could learn something from these people.

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[–] SerLava@hexbear.net 27 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I'm pretty sure the modern conception of socialism came out of the French Revolution and cropped up here and there in the early 19th century, and was pretty janky before people started figuring things out. More like a pre-Model T car or something. Clank clank awooga socialism

[–] ComradeEchidna@hexbear.net 22 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I mean even in Marx's time the term socialism had gotten incredibly confused and ambiguous. That's why "Communist" was chosen instead. And scientific socialism specified.

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[–] Maoo@hexbear.net 73 points 1 year ago

What anticommunism does to your brain.

[–] BidensGranddaughter@hexbear.net 66 points 1 year ago

He's just another left-liberal who thinks THE solution is taxing the wealthy and having stronger unions, as if those are even viable options under a bourgeois democracy.

I stopped even paying attention to him when he first ran under The People's Party, a group of/closely-tied to LaRouchites. I assume the grift is to just get money from whatever Bernie supporters haven't moved further left since 2020? I dunno, anyone still falling for this song and dance should read "Left-Wing" Communism: An Infantile Disorder by lenin-pensive

[–] batsforpeace@hexbear.net 57 points 1 year ago

I think his communication style gets people thinking he's more radical than he really is, it also did for Obama in the beginning. Parenti would call out people like Hedges and Chomsky for sus logic or statements and they didn't go as far as this tweet.

[–] axont@hexbear.net 55 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

He's got some good takes and some wacky ones. He also talks in a way that would suggest he's very radical, like he calls people brother and sister, and he's got a very powerful speaking voice. He's got a good sense of oration and he's not afraid to throw around words like imperialism, structural racism, stuff like that. I think if you wanna look into West's ideology, I think he's caught up in too much religious symbols and metaphysical stuff to ever reach what we'd call coherent leftism. He's a 1990s style leftist, when the smell of Marxism had drifted away, when any radicalism had been defeated, when everyone was a kind of utopian.

But you're right. He's another ivy league professor. They're always going to betray you, because they're at their core just some academics who write papers. It's the same with how people will occasionally get whiplash from something Zizek says.

So far the only ivy league professors who have never betrayed me have been Michael Parenti, Richard Wolff, Paul Buhle, and Jodi Dean. They're very cool and know what they're talking about. There's also Vijay Prashad who is possibly one of the best Marxist academics right now, at least among English speaking academia. China probably has some kickass scholars I've never heard of. I have a gut feeling there are some good academics who write in Spanish too.

[–] Mardoniush@hexbear.net 34 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The way to tell if an intellectual is going to knife you is simple. What do they do outside of the university? Do they organise at grass roots level? Are they cadre in a political org? Or do they just posture at every election and protest to sell books?

There are some exceptions like how Chomsky had bad takes while being legitimately involved in material work, but Chomsky is at least consistent in his bad takes, he doesn't betray his own stated values at a moments notice. (He's always walked an inconsistent line of electorialism vs anarchism, for instance)

[–] axont@hexbear.net 21 points 1 year ago

Yeah this is a good metric. Cornel West has mainly just done speeches his whole life. He's been involved with DSA too, but mainly as a distant advisor role. He was famously at the Charlottesville thing as a counter-protestor and there was some kind of violent confrontation where some antifa defended him, which is pretty cool honestly.

I don't know what to make of West honestly. I've read his books and from those alone you'd think he's got it figured out. Clear and concise condemnations of structural racism in the US and where it comes from. But from his interviews and speeches he sounds more vague, more fuzzy, less capable of presenting a coherent plan or message.

I still want to like him because he was instrumental in my own development. I read his books as a teenager and they stuck with me, but he's frankly a relic of a bygone age. He's stuck 30 years ago when the moment's long since passed him.

[–] Nakoichi@hexbear.net 54 points 1 year ago

Opportunist

[–] SorosFootSoldier@hexbear.net 50 points 1 year ago (2 children)

His VP is going to be Peter Daou and on day one he will resign and chairman daou will lead the revolution.

[–] MaxOS@hexbear.net 31 points 1 year ago

"Daou is the time!" chairman-daou

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[–] CaliforniaSpectre@hexbear.net 48 points 1 year ago (4 children)

So everyone here is voting de la Cruz, right? anakin-padme-2

[–] emizeko@hexbear.net 30 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)
[–] Poison_Ivy@hexbear.net 26 points 1 year ago (1 children)
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[–] edge@hexbear.net 22 points 1 year ago (6 children)

0% chance PSL will be on my ballot.

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[–] footfaults@hexbear.net 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Guess I'll write her in but it would be better if she had ballot access

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[–] MattsAlt@hexbear.net 44 points 1 year ago (1 children)

And where did that lead you? Back to me PSL lenin-fancy

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[–] GarbageShoot@hexbear.net 41 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

He is the latest grifter that the rubes on this website fell for now that Bernie and AOC are gauche and RFK let the mask slip

[–] BurgerPunk@hexbear.net 29 points 1 year ago

Another social imperialist sheep dogger. Some people still haven't moved past free healthcare and legal weed

[–] JoeByeThen@hexbear.net 41 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

There was a good comment that had a rundown of the ways West helped undermine a lot of civil rights type stuff but I can't find it in the search and it's making me think I'm losing it.

edit: I think this was it

[–] NephewAlphaBravo@hexbear.net 25 points 1 year ago

god damn it sadness

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[–] Freeanotherday@hexbear.net 39 points 1 year ago

Fucking idiot, mostly.

[–] Cummunism@hexbear.net 36 points 1 year ago

scratch a lib

[–] Crowtee_Robot@hexbear.net 34 points 1 year ago (4 children)

In this day and age can you sincerely run for president of the US and not be a liberal?

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[–] WIIHAPPYFEW@hexbear.net 31 points 1 year ago

Look at my progressive movement Dawgggggg I'm trapped in the belly of this horrible machine and the machine is bleeding to death😫🤯🤣

[–] footfaults@hexbear.net 28 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I was willing to look past that WSJ op Ed he wrote recently but this is a deal breaker for me.

[–] buh@hexbear.net 26 points 1 year ago

wake up Mr. West 😔

[–] ProfessorAdonisCnut@hexbear.net 26 points 1 year ago (6 children)

We have footage of the guy at an underground Zionist war council, so take that into consideration

[–] RyanGosling@hexbear.net 24 points 1 year ago

This movie is dedicated to the brave wolverine fighters of Colorado

[–] BurgerPunk@hexbear.net 24 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

He used to go on Real Time a lot. So I've always found that sus smurf-cursed

Taking him in complete good faith, I'd say he's a Bernie style social imperialist. Like Bernie its either some genuine left anti-communist stuff, or they've accepted that framing as the confines of US dialogue. And that's taking him in the most positive light possible. There's plenty of reason tobdoubt that.

Either way I'm inclinded to say the Bernie style social imperialism, free health care, legal weed phase of radicalizing has come to end of its usefulness, and that there's diminishing returns on this sort of campaign for the revolutionary left.

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[–] Jenniferr@hexbear.net 22 points 1 year ago (1 children)
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