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I have problems with people who abstained. The hard thing is, how do you change voter behavior?
We had a choice between voting in a system that allows us some power to dissent and have a voice versus... this. The frustrating thing is this situation was just as advertised in Project 25, and then some.
We did not have an ideal choice, but we still had one. Now, here we find ourselves.
Y'know what this thread has made me realize? All the dumb memes of "the left fighting the left" are bullshit. I can respectfully debate other people on the left with me. I can change their minds about some things, they can change my mind on some things, we can come to compromises. I don't agree with the communist 100%, but I agree with them at least 70-80%, and would happily work alongside them to accomplish that 70-80%.
You know who loves infighting though? Centrists who have deluded themselves into thinking they are leftists. You can find comment after comment in this thread from right-leaning centrists, gleefully demanding that they were "right all along" and how everything is our fault for just not being as smart as them. There is no political group that loves infighting as much as them, even more than the fascists. They want to spend the next four years trying to find out all the ways they can assign blame to the left, instead of organizing and doing anything.
Liberals thinking they are leftists refusing to realize they are actually conservatives in everything but brandng, but never having the dawn of enlightenment on that they are wrong, not the people who have been using the terms for centuries.
Oh the irony.
Oh hey it's the liberal troll who is smug and hates everyone who doesn't blindly agree with their favorite leader.
How goes the stalking and alienating your allies?
hell yeah dude! im glad my post was able to set the stage for this realization :)
I advocated for voting for Harris, and did so when the time came. I also don't think this blame game gets us anywhere, and I'm already a little sick of talking about it.
I'm also done defending the Democratic Party as a whole. Individuals, yes, but not the party. I'm realizing through this that I have a certain reflexive need to correct misinformation about Democrats, but I'm clamping down on it.
Good, good. Let the hate flow through you. Come to the left side where we want to rid ourselves of the capitalist class entirely and stop trying to negotiate with them through their puppet political parties. You are so close, I feel it in the force.
This is real life and people are dying. Do you have to be so flippant?
At least the better part of them are now posting under the hashtag #DonaldOfDeath.
From my perspective, as someone who didn't have a vote in US politics and wanted you guys to vote to kick the can down the road until next time, but also understood the sentiment of those who didn't bother, it wasn't a belief that Trump would do any better so much as a loss in faith that the Democrats were who they claimed to be.
When hope dies, it might be replaced by despair, anger, and desperation, or it might be replaced by apathy.
And while that was going on, there was also propaganda going on where people were trying to push the idea that Trump would be any better. I don't believe that there were a significant number of voters who voted for Trump or stayed home because they believed that to be true.
Right now, it looks like the main conflicts about this I'm seeing on this platform are those with hope trying to rally the troops, while those with anger are mainly upset at those with apathy.
Well put. From this framework, Trump didn’t win. Apathy did.
I have problems with people who abstained. The hard thing is, how do you change voter behavior?
I didn't abstain. I voted for a candidate that didn't support genocide while living in a solidly oligarch controlled state. What you would probably call "throwing my vote away."
But no voter had a say in this past election. It was a struggle between the corporatist and oligarch branches of the capitalist class, and the oligarchs threw more money at buying the election.
That's it. No need to vote shame, regardless of if someone did or did not vote. It should be blatantly obvious by now that the Office of the President is (well, was) a rental. Now the oligarchs bought it from the corporatist landlords and plan to remodel and reside in it forever.
There is no war but class war. Nobody is coming to save us. We have to save ourselves. Organize. Let's make voting useful again.
Ultimately yes, its the fault of the voters (and non voters) who let their emotions cloud their judgement. Thats true whether you like it or not. Especially if Gaza was your main issue; if you saw both candidates and thought Trump was better for the situation, you need to seriously look inward and consider your reasoning abilities.
That being said, the opposition party does not get off the hook so easily here. The fact that Trump could win despite everything he said is a total and utter failure. Their strategy is bad, and they refuse to acknoledge it because to do so means that they need to upend their internal heirarchy. They have buried their heads in the sand when it comes to accepting the playing field of politics right now, and quite frankly as a party they look incredibly weak.
In other words, to not acknoledge that the election was theirs to lose is also denying reality
Democrats also have a fair share of blame for refusing to work with the left, and instead siding with war criminal Dick fucking Cheney.
If they had made any effort to inspire people to vote for them they would have gotten more votes.
Honestly I'm surprised they got as many votes as they did seeing as they actively worked to alienate their vote base.