this post was submitted on 28 Dec 2024
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Ye Power Trippin' Bastards
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This is a community in the spirit of "Am I The Asshole" where people can post their own bans from lemmy or reddit or whatever and get some feedback from others whether the ban was justified or not.
Sometimes one just wants to be able to challenge the arguments some mod made and this could be the place for that.
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I agree with the mods on this one. You don't go into people's spaces and tell them they're living wrong unless they're actively hurting other people. And at the end of the day, using a different word as a pronoun isn't going to hurt you. Heck if you have an app you can just tag them with it.
Using a different word as a pronoun does no harm at all. Requiring that other people gender you properly is perfectly reasonable. Demanding that other people go along with calling you a dragon, and whining about it in ways that cause needless drama if they don’t, does do harm.
This whole issue has absolutely nothing to do with trans rights. The right to tell someone who you think is being ridiculous, that they’re being ridiculous, is an important right on an open communications network. Infringe on that right, and your network suddenly isn’t a good place to be anymore, because people will have their conversations non-consensually interfered with by patently ridiculous stuff which they won’t be permitted to say anything back to. On a network where quite literally the only available currency is words, that is a significant loss.
The conversations will be fine. I've had quite a few with drag and nothing has ever interrupted us. You're literally making up reasons to be outraged by someone's identity.
its not the pronouns. its the excuse to behave in a manner which is tyrannical and using made up pronouns to shield you from any criticism.
these places get to a point where inclusivity becomes weaponized. "if you're not immediately accepting of my specific demands, you're transphobic. don't dare ask questions. Cis scum only does that."
there's a fairly obvious line between the two. and this seems pretty apparently an attempt to use othergender stuff in a way to control others.
That's not it. All pronouns are made up. There are people out there right now using Xe/Xim and they're accepted. If you change languages the words change there too. Identity is consistently a big deal in the trans space, as seen by dead naming and conservative jokes about pronouns.
So we don't get to make that decision anymore and honestly it's the easiest thing in the world. They aren't controlling me by telling me to use their pronouns, for example I can still tell them they're wrong on an issue, I can still walk away, I can still take an ad out telling the world that person has a bad take, I can still ignore them or let them live rent free in my head. Saying pronouns control other people is ridiculous. The only thing they control is the identity of the person using them.
read what I said again. its not the pronouns. its using them as a way to weaponize what is and isn't acceptable.
"This person dared to ask a question about how I identify myself, they're a terf for even asking!"
"This person said Fae creatures aren't real! i am angry at them, BAN!"
if you accept these two above examples as good and logical, then we will never agree. and frankly, defending those who behave in such a manner makes a larger divide between those that are trans or othergender and those that aren't.
people are allowed to ask questions and try and clarify what they don't understand. and having to remember specific pronouns for every individual on an internet forum is a completely unacceptable thing to ask.
When said in regards to not wanting to use a person’s preferred pronouns, yes that is a bad-faith argument. And, while I don’t agree with everything Ada does (or has done here), she is dedicated to making a safe space for her users with one of the rules being that you are to respect pronouns no matter what.
Also, I’m feeling more and more like Drag is dronerights, who was definitely a troll, but that will not make me use the wrong pronouns for Drag, and not necessarily for Drag’s sake but for the sake of anyone who feels better using neopronouns. In a discussion about this post on Hexbear, a user talked about how worried hy was asking for them to be included on the list. Even if Drag is a troll, there are people out there who are not and want these things.
asking to be referred to by pronouns is a reasonable request. asking people to refer to you by pronouns of fictional creatures is also reasonable, but when refused does not make the one who refused a bad person.
humans exist. she/he/they absolutely exists. dragons do not exist. nor do fae creatures.
its not unreasonable to refuse to give in to someone's delusion.
if you wish to refer to them by the pronouns they made up, that's fine. but its not reasonable to ask everyone to conform to that delusion.
and quite frankly, I see it as quite harmful to trans individuals. as it groups transgender individuals with those who are othergender and simply gives more excuses to say that real transgender people aren't legitimate.
That's not even remotely what happened. They refused to use the pronouns after being told what they were. Which is something a Terf would do, since you brought the term up.
its not reasonable to assume everyone will just do what you want because you want it. those kinds of pronouns are not ones based in reality.
that doesnt make them terfs. it just means they disagree with you. disagreeing with someone is not a capital offense.
Walks like a terf, talks like a terf... Is threatened by other people's self description like a terf. Oh no, watch out the word is going to bite you!
in one ear and out the other, I see. best of luck.
Yeah. The benefit of the decentralized fediverse is that individual smaller communities can enforce standards like this that may be unreasonable to enforce on something much larger-scale.
You're allowed to vehemently disagree with my lifestyle choices and think that what I do and say is dumb and stupid. And there are environments where discourse calling me out for what you think is stupid is welcome. But clearly, blahaj is not that space. Most of the internet is a space where those who use neopronouns have to fairly constantly defend their use of them, and blahaj seems to have been created very specifically to be a place where such constant vigilance is unnecessary for their users.