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I actually agree with you. However, the right wing won, full stop unfortunately.
Arguing "no true leftist" or "Your side" is pointless. The Right won and no amount of semantics or told you so is going to change the results.
So when they start mass deporting or rounding up trans people we can just say "the dems didn't run progressive enough policie for me" and wash our hands of it I guess.
Harris/Biden ran a dumb campaign. You cant only blame the voters for the loss. They didnt own those campaign decisions.
There's plenty of blame to go around and the DNC bear the majority of it for sure.
Trump won every swing state. He lost my state and all of my states electoral college delegates are going to Harris. I could have voted for Mickey Mouse and this fact would not be different.
Other voters in swing states had real issues with the economy, crime, and less so the genocide in Israel.
Kamala unfortunately pivoted to the right and embraced republicans and corporate CEO’s. Why vote for republican light (Kamala) when you can just vote republican (Trump)? I assume this is what people were thinking.
In other words, they were lied to and bought it hook, line, and sinker.
These voters had issues and concerns.
Trump addressed them.
Kamala and the DNC shamed them and only said it would be worse under Trump.
Voters are worried about the economy. It was the number one issue, especially in swing states.
Trump had a news conference and talked about how expensive beans are.
Kamala had a news conference where she talked about how the economy was already better, while embracing Dick Cheney and 80 corporate CEOs.
Right. We are facing very complex problems that have no simple answers.
People want a simple answer, and that's what Trump gave them. Truth is irrelevant.
The problem is that people on the left tend to actually have ethics and morals.
Kamala didn’t even talk about these issues for the most part. She barely discussed the few tiny things Biden actually accomplished that helped these voters.
Her political messaging was 💩 because again, she has no real values. She will comply with her donors no matter what they request of her.
In short, she does not care about her constituency.
Both Biden and Kamala are to the right of center on the political spectrum. Biden has taken more AiPAC money than any other US politician in history, and Netanyahu still bitch slapped Biden for not groveling hard enough.
This is the current political class.
Trump, as weird as he is…. Is not in the political class. He is not an establishment politician, and it’s refreshing to see someone do something independently of their “friends and colleagues” in Washington. In my personal opinion, trump is a rambling buffoon who only cares about his own ass. But I believe a lot of voters like him because he is something different, and after more than half a century of establishment politicians who are full of smiling lies and bullshit, Trump is a unique character on the us political stage. He also talks about issues these voters care about.
And you have made it clear that you prefer they have none.
What's your actual endgame then?
I see you talking a lot of shit but you don't actually have anything constructive to say. Makes it look like you're just arguing in bad faith or worse.
I have a question for you: how is your support of Harris any different than anyone elses?
It's certainly easy for people who want the status quo to never change to demand an endgame from those that want it to change.
You want constructive? Ok. Gee, it's great how the "good" party is supporting genocide. Best shit ever. Glad they were willing to go to bat for Netanyahu even though it meant losing to Trump.
I don't expect her to be exempt from criticism, and I don't scream that anyone who doesn't love genocide and only genocide like you do is a Russian like you did in our other conversation.
That's an incorrect assumption and doesn't answer the question.
Your candidate (remember you said you voted Harris) supported that so gtfo with your righteous indignation. If you want to play that game you're to blame as well.
OK? Criticize all you like, that's what I was doing before you decided that somehow YOUR support for Harris was different than every other persons on lemmy.
So I'll ask again, how did you support Harris but aren't a genocide supporting democratic voter but think others are?
I'm not sure those people exist. Lemmy seems to think they do but the electorate doesn't reflect that at all and unless they're ready to arm themselves and fight (and they're not, as much as they like to talk about it online) they may as well not exist.
Not sure what you are responding to. Your response is kind of vague. Voters are saying they voted on the economy and immigration among other issues. Trump was speaking to these issues while Kamala was not.
I'm not sure those voters exist. Lemmy thinks that they do but i don't see any evidence that they're real people.
At any rate there's little difference between not-voting and not-existing in the grand scheme so now we get to see what happens when an unashamed fascist wins and surrounds himself with yes men.
Unless those principled non-voters are ready to arm themselves and actually agitate, they might as well not exist and we can proceed accordingly.
I still don’t understand your point.
All you’re doing is continuing to shame voters who didn’t vote for your candidate, even after these voters told your candidate what their priorities were.
The only substantial thing Kamala ran on was that she wasn’t Trump. Outside of not being Trump she is a shell of a human being who has no real values and will always change her views based on the campaign contributions she receives. Voters saw through her fake personality.
Continuing to try and shame voters for not supporting your candidate isn’t going to accomplish anything, much in the same way Obama and Hillary trying to shame voters accomplished little as well.
The DNC can’t even beat a buffoon like Trump because they are so bought and paid for by corporate and dark money PACs.
Maybe try stop trying to blame voters and focus your energies in that direction.
I don't disagree with anything you've said except.
Who was MY candidate? I had to vote for the same milquetoast dem every other functional adult did. I weighed the options and made a decision. If some hypothetical non-voters think they have a better solution let's see it, they should be ashamed. Sitting in basements screeching online doesn't accomplish anything so let's fucking go.
I'm just waiting for the revolution to start, that's what we all want right?
Shaming voters won’t accomplish anything.
Fundamentally you are shaming voters for bad decisions that your candidate made.
The culpability for losing falls completely on Harris and the DNC, not on anyone else.
Shaming people for not voting for your candidate will push people away rather than recruit more voters to your side.
If you’d rather scream and shout from your soap box shaming voters who are traditionally on your side, feel free. Just know that you will be doing more actual harm for your cause than even any of the non voters did.
I'm shaming dumbfuck voters, abstainers, and the DNC.
Start the revolution or roll over and take it unlubed, we're all waiting.
Well, shaming voters that you want to be on your side is a losing strategy.
Kamala can gtfo of here, if she never appears on the political stage again it will be too soon.
The leadership of the DNC does not speak for the voters.
Shaming voters is a losing strategy.
Demanding accountability from the DNC is 100% what’s needed.
I don’t have a clue what you are referring to with these vague references of revolution, but again, shaming voters is and always will be a losing strategy.
That's fine, I'm not a strategist or PR freak. I'm some random person on the internet.
I'm not 100% sure either but I bet we're gonna find out over the next decade or so.
Even among your friends and family, shaming is not usually a good strategy.
I think even if your puppy pees or poops on the rug shaming is a losing strategy.
It's much better to actually discuss the root issues, which are usually related to cost of living, and then talk about the best way to resolve those material issues, which goes back to how progressive policies are popular across the board for Americans. The main issue for the DNC, is those policies come at the expense of the capital interests of the donor / business class.
Can’t usually see the roots though
But to be fair, roots is a good movie
I, too, am a random internet stranger! 👋