this post was submitted on 11 Sep 2024
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Examples: Itchy & Scratchy from The Simpsons, The Scary Door from Futurama, or The Grand Inquisitor from Dostoevsky.

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[–] lvxferre@mander.xyz 10 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

This is not exactly what you're asking for (media inside media), but it's really close in spirit (nested narratives), and I really like it: a book written in Portuguese in the XIX century, called Noite na Taverna (Night in the Tavern).

The book has an overarching story of friends telling each other stories in a tavern, over booze; with all those nested stories being about love, despair, and death (it has a strong gothic vibe).

And, as each character tells the others a story, there's always that fishy smell that the story might be actually bullshit; and other characters do raise some doubts about its in-universe veracity (like Bertram does to Solfieri). And you, as the reader, do the same - but in no moment you question the veracity of the overarching story, and you feel like you're inside the tavern alongside the drunkards.

So it's a lot like the author is toying with your suspension of disbelief - redirecting it from the overarching story to the nested stories, and as you doubt the later you get even more immersed into the former.


If I must use an example of media within media, then my choice would be "The Book" within Orwell's 1984. I think that it's a great piece because it shows Orwell's views on politics and society, while still serving narrative and worldbuilding purpose - for Winston it's a material proof of the Inner Party's bullshit, for O'Brien it's a tool of the Inner Party to sniff out dissidence. (Note: 1984 is extremely misrepresented nowadays, I'm aware, but I still like it.)

[–] the_crotch@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Also, the appendix talks about ingsoc policies in the past tense. They lost.

[–] lvxferre@mander.xyz 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I've never noticed this usage of the past tense in the appendix about Newspeak - you're right, it does. And it's also written in standard English, so interpreting it as written in a world after Oceania fell is viable.

And following this line of thought we could even interpret the main story as a narrative within another.

Another possibility is that the appendix is not written in-universe, and uses the past tense because it's how people expect storytelling to be written in English, with Orwell speaking directly to the reader instead of Winston Smith.

[–] the_crotch@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

It's definitely not Winston, he died in the main story. I interpreted it as an unnamed historian writing about this years later. I don't think Orwell would self-insert and write from an in universe perspective.

[–] lvxferre@mander.xyz 3 points 2 months ago

In the second hypothesis it wouldn't be self-inserting; it's more like the author explaining something to the readers, outside the story.