this post was submitted on 24 Jun 2024
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Playing through the dlc I was wondering are spirit ashes the easy mode or are the bosses actually balanced around them? I had an issue with elden ring bosses being so hyper aggressive in fights with attack chains that last 3 months giving you a window for like 5 seconds to attack which as a strength user seemingly was impossible to do anything without a not strength build. Taking any boss head on feels like a challenge run in an older fromsoft games some elden ring bosses gave me more shit than sekiro.

But when I summon the fight actually kinda feels balanced around it. The attack chain agro being taken away momentarily so you can deliver some damage then playing a kind of hot potato until the fight ends.

Usually easy modes in fromsoft games are a limited resource, humanity for summoning players that also puts you at risk of invasion or finite use healing items to use when you run out of flasks (not ds2) the concept was to make the game easier there needed to be a risk nothing was given for free.

Now that's what's strange about spirit summons, they're practically free. Outside of a little fp/hp cost there is no risk and no drawback to summoning them. Which makes me wonder if the game was intentionally balanced around players using them for every boss fight.

Thoughts?

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[โ€“] peppersky@hexbear.net 10 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Usually easy modes in fromsoft games are a limited resource, humanity for summoning players that also puts you at risk of invasion or finite use healing items to use when you run out of flasks (not ds2) the concept was to make the game easier there needed to be a risk nothing was given for free.

Was there actually ever any game after Demon Souls where the coop enabling item wasn't in some way farmable, if just by helping other players in coop?

I do feel like spirit ashes are just a continuation of From making coop play easier and easier while at the same time giving offline players coop-like options. Dark Souls 1 already introduced NPC summons and added tons of ways to farm humanity (including giving the player passive soft humanity just from beating enemies), Spirit Ashes are simply way to allow the player to almost always have a summon available, while also integrating them into the loot and progression system.

Elden Ring certainly does feel like the bosses are tuned for you to either be in coop or use the summons, but I feel that the game encouraging you to use any option you have when interacting with the world is more in tune with the spirit of these games than the 1v1, no summons, no magic, sword only mindset some players have. It just obviously sucks when a boss is impossible when playing solo and a cakewalk when using summons, but for the most part they get the balance somewhat in the middle.

I've only beaten two of the rememberance bosses in the DLC so far and while I did use both the NPC summons and the mimic tear for them, both fights ended with both of my summons dead and me without healing items, making for a pretty tense finish, which seems pretty much perfect.

[โ€“] Gorb@hexbear.net 6 points 4 months ago

but I feel that the game encouraging you to use any option you have when interacting with the world is more in tune with the spirit of these games than the 1v1, no summons, no magic, sword only mindset some players have

Actually thats a fair point i forgot about. All the souls games provide a massive arsenal for dealing with just about any problem outside of sekiro which is a very directed experience. But to use that arsenal is generally deemed as cheese even though it's all mechanically viable.

My first run through all the games was a cheese run, i threw dung over the wall of the capra demon boss fight and skipped half the game with the master key. Adorned myself with Havel's armour and face tanked Manus without dodging once.

I got lost in the sauce of naked katana nohit mentality