I always thought it was purely social conditioning, but I've got a theory that just popped in my head. I wonder if women need to be more vocal to communicate "Yes that's good, keep doing that"? Like frankly my partner is often in charge of pace, depth, and even calling for position changes. I'm letting him know with my noises how good something is for me, If you should keep doing it, or if I get quiet he knows to try something different. I don't mind him being quiet at all, until I'm on top and then I'm like I literally cannot tell if this is good for you. I have to ask out loud "is that good?" And then change something, "is that good?" After a blow-job I have to ask him, what parts did you like more than the other parts? Obviously I can tell he's into it overall, but It's really hard to know if a rhythm or amount of pressure is better than another if moaning doesn't increase when you try something. Like he can absolutely tell when he hits a good spot when fingering me because my moans make it very obvious. I will straight say, "yes," "please," "right there," "don't move." All kinds of stuff. It's not just about making it hotter for the other person, it's about communicating how good something is for you so they don't have to do as much guessing
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I just figured the guy's concentrating on keeping up the good work without blowing it.
I've also always thought it may have to do with social conditioning, but possibly on a non-sexual level. My thought is that guys are (generally) conditioned to be more quiet about intimate things, or things that are good, and more loud in "aggressive" situations. This fits well with the factual observation that men are less likely to talk about personal problems with a friend, and more likely to push the boundaries (be vocal) in an interview. In my head, it's an extension of the "strong, silent" stereotype, which is often regarded as positive. Women, on the other hand, are (typically) socially conditioned to be more vocal about feelings in general. I wouldn't be surprised if these conditionings bleed over into how vocal people are during sex.
With that said: I'm a guy, and my gf likes it when I make noises. Once I got used to it, I also learned to enjoy grunting. Grunting is highly recommended.
I make some noise, no idea how enjoyable it is for the other person, mostly alot of grunting or abusive language. It gets comedic when I’m like, “Yeah bitch, I’m gonna fuck that pussy all night.” Then I cum like 10 seconds later.
This is why lesbians have better sex.
You have fingers and a mouth, you don't need to stop fucking all night after you cum.
As a straight, I wish I had fingers and a mouth. At least I can have multiple orgasms. Suck it, penis-owners!
Suck it, penis-owners!
Look, if we could we would, but then you'd never see us again.
As a straight, I wish I had fingers and a mouth.
Words cannot describe my confusion.
The problem is more that cumming is the goal for many guys.
I may won't last long when penetrating, but we still have fun for hours before and after it.
And I think that's a point about how to approach sex, not about sexual identity
Trans woman here, and I can say from first hand experience that hormones change sexual response and desire. I'm guessing (and only guessing) that that is at least a part of the reason.
I know my own experience changed and i vocalise more, but even I can't tell you why.
You know I've never really thought about it until now, but besides the hormones helping your body match who you are, do the hormones change anything mentally? I assume no personality changes, but I've wondered if things like senses, pain, temperature tolerance etc. change.
Edit: that's wild y'all. thanks for the answers.
Oh goddess does the temperature tolerance change. Turns out the fat distribution matters a lot for that!
Also yeah there's a line in the first altered carbon book about how for men, skin is armor, and for women, a sensory organ, and it's a little exaggerated, but it's pointing at a real thing.
Re personality: that's harder to judge, because you have so much going on. It's a major change in your life, you're altering how you and the world interact with each other, so it would be hard to avoid your personality going through a rock to mud transition and shifting, but I think there's definitely some shift towards social responsibility, yeah. Obviously there isn't an exact measurement, but I think it's pretty common.
I've never heard about women's skin being generally more sensitive, that's really interesting! I always thought the difference in temperature tolerance had to do with women having a thicker sub-skin fat layer (might not be the correct English term for "underhudsfett"). Have you noticed any other physiological changes that you think can be attributed to the transition?
Sorry if I'm a bit direct, I just think the biology of the human body is fascinating, and I've never really before thought of the insight that we can get from people that have experienced "both sides" of the spectrum, so to speak.
Pelvic tilt is a pretty obvious one, part of why women have shapelier asses and also reduces height a little bit. Emotions definitely feel more accessible, although I have heard that trans guys also get some of that sometimes so that might have more to do with dissociating less, but I also get some urge to cry at stuff like... Last night I was watching a movie with my girlfriend and characters were talking about people they'd lost, and it was an effort not to cry.
You can ask me literally anything you actually want to know about without losing points with me. Just be sure you want to know. There's a pretty good chance I'll answer and if you didn't want to know you might have regrets.
Cool! I didn't know about the pelvic tilt either, and it's interesting to hear that both mtf and ftm transitioners (is that the right term?) have similar experiences regarding emotional accessibility. And thanks for opening for questions, I'm going to fire off a couple right away:
Have you experienced any change in sleep patterns?
Any significant change in appetite? If yes, how? Both regarding amounts, and what kind of food you "crave"?
I'm assuming you don't menstruate, but do you have any kind of hormonal "cycle" that would be similar? If so, how is it?
PS. It's veery late in my time zone, so I have to sleep now, but I appreciate any answers I get, and I'm looking forward to reading them :)
Different transfem here, but I can say that I've had a big change in sleep patterns. I'm a much lighter sleeper now and wake up a lot easier and earlier than I used to. It was a fast and persistent change
My sense of smell is much better now, and that was also a very fast change. I enjoy food more as a result, and have a wider palette. No special cravings, though.
You asked earlier about mental changes - for me that was profound. I'm much calmer and happier now, and feel emotions 'flowing' and processing better than before. I used to struggle with anxiety and anger, but now I'm generally more balanced and when I do feel difficult emotion it's easier to make sense of it and move forward. Before I would often have a sense of what I call emotional "heat" where I knew I was having a strong emotional reaction and felt a drive to act on it, but I would struggle to understand of articulate exactly what I was feeling. Now, in similar conditions I don't feel such a big impulsive motivation and it's easier to think through and express the nuance of my emotional experience. This was the change I wanted the very most from HRT and it's been wonderful to experience.
Of course, everyone is unique and has different receptors, responses, etc. I started from having exceptionally high T levels, and now have typical cis female T and E levels.
There's no common language name for the fat layer under the skin in English. The medical term is most often used which is subcutaneous fat.
Edit: Using "cutaneous" for skin is borrowing straight from Latin which is a little odd. Not because of the Latin, lots of medical and scientific terminology is Latin origin, but because almost every other time we talk about the skin we use the Greek term "dermis".
Skin sensitivity, smell, taste, posture, temperature tolerance, it can all change!
Trans man, I would say I vocalize more now that I'm T but that might just have to do with my life circumstances significantly improving at the same time, so I tend use my voice more often in general.
Because of this : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_copulatory_vocalizations
Thank you for posting this. I knew a woman's orgasm had a purpose in insemination but vocalizations indicating the best time for male ejaculation makes sense.
And about a billion times more sense than some of the nonsense posted in this thread.
On the other hand, recent studies have indicated that most copulatory vocalizations in women do not accompany their own orgasm, but rather their partner's ejaculation. The study showed that the man typically finds the woman's vocalization arousing and highly exciting, and that the woman herself is aware of this.
Vocalizations can be used intentionally by women in order to boost the self-esteem of their partner and to cause quicker ejaculation.
Ha, name a woman that hasn't done this to hurry along bad sex.
Try it sometime, my wife loves it and I grew to not be shy about it. There is something about letting out moans and noises that makes sex so much better.
I started screaming. It's basically a heavy metal concert in our room now.
Hell yeah, brother. Helps you get into that primal mode.
You guys are all over thinking this. A lot. I'm pretty sure it's because basically all porn has a very loud female role and a near silent male role. There's been lots of studies on how porn affects people's actual sex lives. Vocalization is a part of that. Girls watch it in formative years, learn "This must be what my partner will find hot," just like tons of other emulated behavior from other media. Boys do the same.
my gf loves it when i make noise
Same reason dogs don't bark when they chase the mail truck.
Porn has done it for dozens of years at this point, and it has just become not only an expectation, but just a thing that gets picked up.
See moaning and panting and the softly whispered "fuuuuucky yes" more as a means of expressing arousal and excitement. My SO is fairly vocal (involuntarily, I love it), but I had to learn it first. It really feels good tho', I suppose it depends on what your partner wants/likes?
As a trans woman, I noticed it started happening fully unintentionally after HRT. It's anecdotal, but makes me feel like there's definitely a chemical component because it actually surprised me.
I wonder how much of that is placebo effect.
My honest guess is all of it
I grunt and moan to signify my effort and enjoyment.
Before I transitioned I was pretty much silent. Hormones affected that some, but I have to say I got way more vocal post-op. First time I got it in the vagina I was quite loud.
I think some of it is just what genitals people are rocking.