this post was submitted on 14 Jan 2025
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Fediverse memes

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Blog post by Christine Lemmer-Webber, co-editor of ActivityPub: https://dustycloud.org/blog/how-decentralized-is-bluesky/

The likely answer to this is that there will always have to be a large corporation at the heart of Bluesky/ATProto, and the network will have to rely on that corporation to do the work of abuse mitigation, particularly in terms of illegal content and spam. This may be a good enough solution for Bluesky’s purposes, but on the economics alone it’s going to be a centralized system that relies on trusting centralized authorities.

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[–] Turret3857@infosec.pub 39 points 3 days ago (3 children)

I mean Ive been working on figuring out how to use this: https://github.com/itaru2622/bluesky-selfhost-env

Ive gotten pretty close, just a few small issues now I'm trying to figure out. I mean as long as its FOSS and self host able idgaf if its corporate. The CIA made SELinux and its one of the tools I use daily. FUTO makes GrayJay and its another tool that I use daily.

I hate corpos, don't get me wrong, but if theyre actually giving you Something for free (free as in freedom, not as in free beer) I dont see the problem.

[–] Shatur@lemmy.ml 31 points 3 days ago

Yes, you can self-host it, but the problem is the cost. The blog explains it very clearly.

[–] refurbishedrefurbisher@lemmy.sdf.org 21 points 3 days ago (3 children)

The CIA didn't make SELinux. Not sure where you got that from.

It was the NSA lol

[–] SatyrSack@feddit.org 25 points 3 days ago (1 children)

The CIA invented crack cocaine, and that's another tool that I use daily.

[–] frayedpickles@lemmy.cafe 2 points 3 days ago

That was the FBI

[–] naught@sh.itjust.works 10 points 3 days ago

They confused 3 letter evil agencies -- not surprising

[–] Turret3857@infosec.pub 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

CIA, NSA, FBI, LOL, PEN15, theres so many to remember. it was made by an american alphabet soup org.

My vote is for PEN15

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 7 points 3 days ago

Let us know how it goes, really curious to see how much an enthusiast can self-host!

[–] Duamerthrax@lemmy.world 19 points 3 days ago

Right now, I just want twitter to lose.

[–] Glasgow@lemmy.ml 9 points 3 days ago (1 children)

No reason it has to be one cooperation. Could be multiple different appviews ran by trusted entities.

[–] WhoLooksHere@lemmy.world 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

And if my grandma had wheels she'd be a bicycle.

If it's disadvantageous to the money in control of it, it won't happen.

[–] Glasgow@lemmy.ml 6 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

It is happening though. There’s workgroups trying to get their own AppView up, the https://freeourfeeds.com/ initiative announced yesterday, and then moving the register to an ICANN-like consortium.

[–] atro_city@fedia.io 8 points 3 days ago (3 children)

People fleeing twitter to bluesky are like frogs jumping out of one boiling pan into another pan that's slowly starting to heat up.

[–] ahornsirup@feddit.org 60 points 3 days ago (2 children)

So give me a Fediverse Twitter alternative that's actually a drop-in replacement for Twitter the way Bluesky is and that is (and this is by far the most important factor) as easy to sign up for as Bluesky is. People aren't leaving Twitter because it's "corporate" or "enshittified", they're leaving because it's the proverbial Nazi bar and they want to jump through as few hoops as possible to get where they want to go. Which is Twitter, minus the Nazi in charge and his followers.

[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 22 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Bingo, people don't join Lemmy because it's a pain in the ass to figure out how it works and if you're unlucky your experience is shit because you joined an instance that isn't federated with some of the major ones.

I've been saying it for a while now, make the decentralization happen in the background and make the front-end appear like any other website and then you've got an alternative that makes sense.

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 4 points 3 days ago (1 children)

make the front-end appear like any other website

So like https://clubsall.com/, who fetches content from all of Lemmy without federating back?

[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Interesting

I was thinking a bit like regular websites. Let's say for Reddit, the hosting might be spread over a hundred servers owned by AWS with redundancy in case one crashed, but it could be a hundred servers owned by a hundred person instead (decentralize the back-end). You need an API to let people develop a front-end allowing users to interact with those servers, but the same credentials could be used on any of those front-ends and users wouldn't have an account associated with a specific server (just like you don't choose what server you're signing up on when joining Reddit).

So yeah, decentralized dumb back-end, decentralized smart front-end, making the experience as user friendly as any centralized website and still removing admins from the equation.

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)
[–] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 1 points 3 days ago

Possibly, I'm not super knowledgeable on the technical side, it's just ideas I've had since joining Lemmy and seeing the flaws with it.

[–] atro_city@fedia.io 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Dude, the reason twitter is a shitty place to be is because of how it works. If you just move to another platform that does exactly the same, it will devolve into the same shithole twitter ~~was~~ is.

Quote-tweets (or whatever they are called) were resisted for so long in mastodon because it leads to toxic "omg, look at this person, let's make fun of them" posts. It's entirely too easy.

Add to it a tiny character limit and the majority of thing people can post is flickers of thoughts and incomplete works. Forcing people to reduce their expression directly leads to information being lost and for confusion or misunderstandings to be more common.

It is insane to repeat the same thing and expect a different outcome. Bluesky might be nice right now, but when twitter falls, the same people will just move to the Bluesky and nothing will have changed.

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 21 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Quote-tweets (or whatever they are called) were resisted for so long in mastodon because it leads to toxic “omg, look at this person, let’s make fun of them” posts. It’s entirely too easy.

Bluesky allows you to block quote-tweets of your posts. That's already a good mitigating measure for this kind of harassment.

Another thing that Bluesky does well is blocklists. We should probably consider something similar here on Lemmy/Mbin, that would help to crowdsource moderation and reduce the workload on mods/admins.

[–] Ofiuco@lemmy.cafe 4 points 3 days ago

Along the lists (for blocking and following), spreading the Bluesky behaviour towards trolls (don't engage, just report and block) would do wonders... Maybe going as far as what old forums did and punish those who keep feeding the trolls.

[–] CidVicious@sh.itjust.works 12 points 3 days ago

The value of social media is 100% in who's on it. Vast majority of people neither know nor care what the fediverse is. They just know a lot of people who don't suck are moving to bluesky.

[–] Leate_Wonceslace@lemmy.dbzer0.com -4 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Honestly, I feel the same way about Reddit and Lemmy. The developers are fascists who think liking Stalin makes them left-wing.

[–] Blaze@feddit.org 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Have you tried https://piefed.social/ or https://kbin.earth/ ? Different devs, compatible with Lemmy

Bookmarked for later reference, ty.

[–] Shawdow194@fedia.io 5 points 3 days ago

And the cycle continues