A Boring Dystopia

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Israel brands Palestinian detainees with numbers on their foreheads (www.middleeasteye.net)

submitted 1 week ago by IndustryStandard@lemmy.world to c/aboringdystopia@lemmy.world

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When Israel re-arrested Palestinian men in the occupied West Bank town of Dura, the detainees faced familiar treatment.

They were blindfolded, handcuffed, insulted and kept in inhumane conditions. More unusual was that each man had a number written on his forehead.

Osama Shaheen, who was released in August after 10 months of administrative detention, told Middle East Eye that soldiers brutally stormed his house, smashing his furniture.

"The soldiers turned us from names into numbers, and every detainee had a number that they used to provoke him during his arrest and call him by number instead of name. To them, we are just numbers."

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[–] Anti_Face_Weapon@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago (2 children)

TBF it depends on the prison. In this comment I will be referring to jails and prisons within the U.S., and I am working with the same assumptions you made in your comment.

People are put in jail without trial all the time, when awaiting trial. This is extremely common especially with poorer people who can't afford bail.

Most prisons and many jails give prisoners a number, and will sometimes even refer to them only by the number. It's not written on their head, but it is often attached to their uniform, and they can sometimes be punished for taking them off. It's weird to write it on their head, and really just kinda silly if you ask me. They probably don't have the resources for name tags because they've spent 200% of the budget on more bombs it seems.

Some jails and prisons have conditions that equate to actual torture according to the UN. Extreme heat without AC, cruel punishments, inadequate nutrition and safety. Most notable of these is solitary confinement, which is a very common prison punishment, and which is rightly classified as torture by the United Nations. Some people spend months or even years or decades in solitary confinement.

I think we all agree that the IDF is committing acts of genocide and inexcusable violence against civilians and captured combatants, but it's also important to not inflate the facts, and to focus our attention on greater issues. Does it really matter so much that the IDF writes a number on their forehead, when they're also bombing children? Is a marker really a greater evil than a bomb?

[–] IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago (1 children)

People can be held in jail before they are charged but they require a charge and a trial.

Here the IDF is picking up people, throwing them in confinement, beating them up and then throwing them out.

Wiithout a trial ever happening. Nor do they plan it to happen. There is no legal system involved.

Comparisons can be made. Guantanamo bay, Uyghur camps, etc. But that is not what most people call a "jail". This is kangaroo court stuff.

I agree that the kids getting bombed is bigger news. But seeing "Israel bombed 50 kids today" every single day doesn not hit the same after a while. And it is not really "boring" in the way this is.

[–] Anti_Face_Weapon@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago

I'm not disagreeing that It is a terrible thing. What they're doing is wrong and they should be punished. However we are not so different, and that is the damn truth of the thing. To that end, my comment was merely pointing out that the previous comments argument was very flawed.

[–] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

This comment conflates jail and prison as if they're the same thing, and they are not. It's an important distinction.

They probably don't have the resources for name tags...

I know you were making a joke, but it is foolish to believe for one second that this wasn't done intentionally as a form of dehumanization and public humiliation.

Does it really matter so much that the IDF writes a number on their forehead, when they’re also bombing children? Is a marker really a greater evil than a bomb?

Yes, it really matters. Both things matter. Do we have to make "Israel war crime" tier lists before determining if we should care about something? It's all awful. And it's all inter-related anyway. This is the type of dehumanization that allows IDF soldiers to murder so many women and children without remorse.

And I could see someone who does not have an understanding of history, and the historical context around this level of dehumanization, could not fully grasp the symbolism here.

But yes, this is something that we 100% should be talking and worrying about.

[–] Anti_Face_Weapon@lemmy.world 0 points 1 week ago

Jails and prisons are for the sake of the argument practically the same thing in that both meet all of these criteria. I am not saying that we shouldn't pay attention to this or catalog it and prosecute the perpetrators, I'm simply saying that the argument of the previous poster was extremely flawed.