this post was submitted on 18 Jul 2023
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not a moral pr(ul)ecept (lemmy.blahaj.zone)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by emstuff@lemmy.blahaj.zone to c/196@lemmy.blahaj.zone
 

sorry i got my rhetoric ™️ wrong last time i am just attempting to illustrate the thesis of Tolerance is not a moral precept by Yonatan Zunger so check that out if ur curious thanks babes <3

[Tolerance] is an agreement to live in peace, not an agreement to be peaceful no matter the conduct of others. A peace treaty is not a suicide pact.

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[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Pretending that you can't specifically outlaw explicitly violent and hateful bigotry without someone else outlawing your own peaceful ideology is the mother of all slippery slope fallacies and is almost exclusively trotted out by people who agree with a lot of the ideology of the bigots.

There's nobody forcing us to go down any "bad path" just because we protect minorities from extremists. Just like there's NOT always two valid sides to an issue (see for example flat earthers, young earth creationists and other science deniers), you don't have to ban democracy in order to ban fascism.

[–] Melpomene@kbin.social 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

People conflate "ban bad actions" and "ban speech" when discussing tolerance; separating those is important. We should ABSOLUTELY ban violence and refuse to acknowledge laws and systems that advocate for those things. We should be both vocal and active in our rejections.

Speech is a separate issue. As stupid as antivaxxers are, as hateful as TERFs are, I don't want government telling them they can't speak. Any law we pass, we should ask ourselves how it might be abused by a bad actor. Better, at least to me, is to out and ruin anyone who expresses hateful, bigoted views.

[–] GlitchyDigiBun@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

To be clear, free speech does NOT protect from social consequence. Let them speak. Let them be ostracized, ridiculed, and demeaned for their hateful speech. Use your own free speech to ensure there are 10 voices of reason for every "loving" Christofacist telling them exactly what we took our stance for in 1865 and 1944. All humans are equal. All humans deserve life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness and every soapbox is at once a platform and a social noose.

[–] Melpomene@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago

100% agree, and this is where I come out. Speak your mind as a fascist and get wrecked with social censure.

[–] ninpnin@sopuli.xyz 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

try explaining that to eg. the terfs

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

If I had a dollar for every time I've argued with terfs about the stupidest of misconceptions, I'd probably buy a house..