this post was submitted on 20 Nov 2024
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No Stupid Questions

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[–] 4grams@lemmy.world 19 points 19 hours ago

This is based on nothing but vibes and my observations but I think so. We were cooked the moment we elected the clown the first time, just been a slower slide than I anticipated. In truth though we already had the disease at that point but it was then it became terminal.

I desperately want to be wrong and will do what I can to prove myself a moron. Fingers crossed.

[–] AnyProgressIsGood@lemmy.world 16 points 19 hours ago (1 children)

It would seem that way. The people elected a guy that tried to overthrow democracy

How do you recover from that

[–] DarkFuture@lemmy.world 12 points 17 hours ago

You probably don't.

Even with a contentious subject like abortion. That's a disagreement about a specific topic. You can reach a middle ground. It's one of many topics to debate over and forge legislation regarding.

But the majority gleefully electing a guy that effectively looked us all straight in the face and said "I don't give a fuck about democracy and will attempt to subvert or overthrow it if it doesn't suit me"? Yeah, there's really no recovering from that. At least not without a long period of serious decline and suffering, followed by lots of struggle and death to earn back what we lose.

We disrespected the shit out of our democracy and everyone that fought/died for it. There's no way that ends well.

[–] The_Picard_Maneuver@lemmy.world 55 points 23 hours ago (2 children)

Progress isn't a straight line, and sometimes there are setbacks on the way. I'm disappointed, of course, but I'm optimistic that we'll manage.

[–] tanisnikana@lemmy.world 18 points 22 hours ago (18 children)

We may yet manage as a country, but the millions that die from this election won’t get to see it.

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[–] indigomirage@lemmy.ca 49 points 23 hours ago

I hope not. But I am fearful that the US electorate has not grasped yet what it threw away.

[–] Modva@lemmy.world 15 points 20 hours ago

That's up to Trump, because your vaunted checks and balances are gone.

Think he's going to show restraint? Insight? Empathy?

[–] Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world 22 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

I was as surprised and disappointed as anyone, and I think we WILL take a few more steps backwards over the next few years, but I don't expect an unstoppable fall into fascism.

Most of the votes for Trump weren't actually FOR Trump. They were against the current situation they are in. They see him as the revolution. The anti-politician that will bring real change. They think all his court battles are the "Man" trying to hold him down and keep him from disrupting a system that gave up on its people long ago.

Of course that's all bullshit, but, assuming that all "normal" people can see through his lies and that only evil, woman hating racists would support him, is a big part of why he was elected.

Trump denied Project 2025 because he knew most people wouldn't want it. (Honestly, I would be surprised if he even knew what was in it) If he lets the Christian nationalists push that whole agenda on day one, he'll become the oppressive government that is taking away their freedoms. And nothing is more important to Trump than making Trump look good.

[–] 7fb2adfb45bafcc01c80@lemmy.world 11 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (1 children)

I'm way more concerned with Vance. Like you say, Trump does what's best for Trump. If Vance becomes VP for whatever reason then ideology takes center stage.

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[–] RickRussell_CA@lemmy.world 19 points 23 hours ago

I think the real answer is that we end up kind of like the UK -- going from the worlds ultra-dominant superpower to a sort of slow regression to the mean, as China, India and others take the spotlight.

When you look at what China is doing with their Belt and Road Initiative, and their move to dominate the transportation infrastructure of developing nations -- the US isn't anywhere near equipped to counter that. We're still in a cold war mentality thinking that we will dominate as the world's police force.

Meanwhile, all the actual economies will be run by Chinese companies operating with state support.

[–] steel_nomad@lemmy.world 0 points 9 hours ago
[–] Wilzax@lemmy.world 13 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

Unless there's nuclear war, there's no such thing as the point of no return. Just a further slide into more egregious civil rights violations. Eventually it will get better, hopefully through democratic means and not violent ones.

[–] OutlierBlue@lemmy.ca 13 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

You don't vote out a dictator. The only way out is through violent revolution.

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[–] Blackmist 4 points 17 hours ago

Doubt it.

The rest of the world isn't lucky enough to never have to hear about the perpetual US election cycle again, and frankly there's just too much money in it for them to give it up.

It'll be a fucking clown show for the next four years though.

[–] SomeAmateur@sh.itjust.works 13 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (1 children)

Sure the US may be past it's glory days. Hell even the Rand Corporation (who write a bunch of stuff for govt leaders and other high ups) says it's been trending downhill since some point in the early 2000s. They didn't mention 9/11 but it seems like a good historical milestone.

Essentially the paper says the last 200 years have been an anomaly and we're slowly sliding back to historical norms. They call it the neomedieval era and it's not just the US.

[–] sunzu2@thebrainbin.org 9 points 23 hours ago

Neo Feudalism is upon us, the frog got to comfortable in this warm water... Now it is too late.

The trend is set and reversal is not on the menu.

Best you can do is quit being poor, otherwise you gonna get progressively more fucked each year.

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 12 points 23 hours ago

Yeah pretty much. We're 2-3 generations deep into a cultural expectation that "some one else" will deal with all these problems.

The constant threat of this being "the most important election of our lives", when the party making that argument campaigned as if the outcomes were irrelevant (because from their privileged perspective, the outcomes are irrelevant).

Back during covid a boat got turned a bit sideways in a canal and it seemed like the whole world economy was going to collapse. The system we have is actually incredibly fragile and built largely on trust, both in one another but also in institutions and systems. Not only the US, but western Europe is about to get smacked up-side the head by the 2x4 of failing to maintain a civil society (US at fault within its borders, EU at fault beyond its borders).

[–] theywilleatthestars@lemmy.world 9 points 22 hours ago

Don't believe there really is an absolute point of no return without the plot of Genesis of the Daleks happening. The future is long, and we don't know how the next four to eight years will play out, but dictatorships have risen and fallen before. Spain was a fascist dictatorship for decades, now it isn't. Also, lots of people died in the meantime and not all vestiges of the dictatorship are gone.

[–] BombOmOm@lemmy.world 10 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (13 children)

Assuming you are talking about who won the US presidential election. Happened 8 years ago too, it wasn't the end of America then. It won't be the end of America now.

[–] Aatube@kbin.melroy.org 13 points 22 hours ago

8 years ago, the GOP wasn't crammed with MAGA, the judiciary wasn't crammed with MAGA, and the executive wasn't going to be crammed with MAGA.

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