this post was submitted on 06 May 2024
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Helldivers 2 PSN Account Insanity... Did we REALLY Win? (www.youtube.com)
submitted 6 months ago by Turd_Ferg@sh.itjust.works to c/games@sh.itjust.works
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[–] inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world 38 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

Not really.

They're waiving the requirement for this game, the upcoming Ghost of Tsushima still requires a PSN account to play the multiplayer DLC and we don't know what the actually no requirement for PSN on Helldivers 2 is yet. My guess is that while we don't have to sign up, cross play will be disabled, which will of course hurt PSN players more than PC players.

I have no confidence in Sony or any AAA publisher to do the right thing when executives with MBA's and shareholder profits tied to their bonuses are involved but I'll take a win if for this one little battle, the consumers won out.

[–] big_slap@lemmy.world 11 points 6 months ago (2 children)

why would cross play be disabled?

[–] inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world 10 points 6 months ago

Just a guess with Sony executives would try to save face and exert some perceived control over their PSN ecosystem.

[–] Z3R0faith@lemmy.world 2 points 6 months ago (2 children)

Most likely because Sony wouldn't have any recourse to take action (e.g.: ban) any players that are violating terms of use that PSN players are required to agree to (obvious examples would be harassment / offensive language that most services will minimally voice/chat ban for).

[–] Saik0Shinigami@lemmy.saik0.com 14 points 6 months ago (1 children)

This is a myth that I have no idea why it's being passed around. Sony can just map steam id's to a range of PSN id's that are effectively throwaway. As an example: "Z3R0faith" steamID -> GoT1238976das76d98a7s6y7fgas7df698a7ysdf PSN ID. Slug it with the game name so you can't run into duplicates. Or don't slug it and just run the steamID through a hash... so a ban on one game will apply to every other Sony game. And just have the game represent you as that ID. Sony bans that ID and that's it. They don't need to have an actual PSN account.

There's no need to have an actual PSN account with any data. They just need to map it on their end when only a steamID is presented.

[–] Badeendje@lemmy.world 4 points 6 months ago

This! I don't understand this whole schtick.. as doing it on the background is probably just as easy. The problem for Sony is that this is considered PII as it is unique to a human being meaning in the EU it can only be processed for a good and explicit reason or with voluntary consent.

Now using the argument it is required in order to provide the service might work.. but then they (Sony) cannot use it for anything else without exposing them to liability of fines at a percentage or global revenue.

[–] big_slap@lemmy.world 3 points 6 months ago (1 children)

really? I think I agreed to a terms of service when I started the game on pc, im sure there is language in there that keeps players in check. I'm gonna verify..

[–] Saik0Shinigami@lemmy.saik0.com 1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I think I agreed to a terms of service when I started the game on pc

They changed the ToS on their site, and EULA's on the steam page in the past week.

Finding anything now is moot. Was it there when you purchased?

[–] Kelly@lemmy.world 2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

They changed the [...] EULA's on the steam page in the past week.

The early March version seems to match the current Steam page.

https://web.archive.org/web/20240304061048/https://store.steampowered.com/eula/553850_eula_0

[–] Saik0Shinigami@lemmy.saik0.com 2 points 6 months ago

Nothing in either version actually mentions anything about mandating a login to their platform either. So my argument with the EULA in specific is moot.

But yes, a diff on BOTH EULA's on the steam page show at least no change in the past couple of months. But that doesn't prove anything about when this specific user purchased the game. A change could have been made, and they would have only agreed to that version. That's the point though, that's something you have to explicitly look out for.

[–] Cyberspark@sh.itjust.works 21 points 6 months ago (1 children)

We haven't won until the region sales restrictions implementation to avoid legal issues of imposing PSN is rolled back. Fellow divers got refunds, we haven't won until everyone can return to diving.

As far as I'm concerned people are far too eager to call this a win and take Sony at their word without actually caring about the result.

To head off obvious responses Steam doesn't impose restrictions on their own, the publisher is in control on sales and it takes no time at all for Steam to update. So why hasn't Sony done this trivial act already? Because they'll try this again later when they legally can.

[–] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today -4 points 6 months ago (1 children)

It'd be cool if yall could ask them to remove the rootkit too, but IK the average helldiver player is already too stupid to care about that issue.

[–] Cyberspark@sh.itjust.works 3 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Unfortunately that's just the way the industry is going. They'd rather just have overreach and excessive power than deal with the back and forth fight of countering hackers and cheats. I understand why they'd go that way, it's disappointing and concerning, but it's becoming more and more common.

You could run such games on a separate machine (provided you had the funds), but that's a big buy in for a single game.

Different people have different tolerances or are ignorant, not stupid. Maybe don't be so condescending to people and you'd get better responses.

[–] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today 4 points 6 months ago (2 children)

Lmao, I can think of exactly 2 publishers who do this and they're getting shredded by critics, rn. Security experts think it's a fucking joke for the company and the users alike. Hopefully not "the way the industry is going", more likely to get banned in modern nations, soon.

Ignorance, especially willful, is not only a good definition of stupid but also a form of evil itself.

[–] Cyberspark@sh.itjust.works 1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Easy Anti-Cheat is Kernel level. Lots more than 2 publishers are using kernel level Anti-Cheat.

I guess you're evil now then? Oops.

[–] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today 0 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Name a few.

[–] hedgehog@ttrpg.network 1 points 6 months ago (2 children)

https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Easy_Anti-Cheat

Took me about thirty seconds to find that list.

[–] Cyberspark@sh.itjust.works 0 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I guess you lose your sense of superiority if you actually listen to what other people say. Making others do their research for them must be the way they cling to their self-worth.

[–] hedgehog@ttrpg.network 2 points 6 months ago (1 children)

???

[–] Cyberspark@sh.itjust.works 1 points 6 months ago

Eh, never mind

[–] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today -1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Lmfao from the first name on this list I can tell you that 7 days to die is not running kernel level anti-cheat. You've illustrated you have no idea what you're talking about.

Kernel Level anticheat requires that it runs at startup of your computer. Examples are Riot's Vanguard and nProtect's GameGuard (which Helldivers 2 uses).

[–] hedgehog@ttrpg.network 1 points 6 months ago

That was my first comment and all I did was share a list of games that have historically used EAC. If a game used EAC at launch then it’s pretty clear that its publishers have used EAC in their games. I made no statements about it being kernel-level or otherwise.

That said, EAC is a kernel-level anticheat, but unlike Vanguard it doesn’t run at startup. A tool being (or not being) kernel-level is a matter of which privileges it has when it runs, not when it starts up. Starting at startup allows an anti-cheat tool to perform more diagnostics and catch cheats that might otherwise go uncaught, but it’s also more invasive and increases the attack surface of people who have it installed.

[–] all-knight-party@kbin.run -3 points 6 months ago (2 children)

If you begin your comment with "lmao" it's immediately condescending and you're unlikely to convince anyone about what you're saying.

[–] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today 2 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (1 children)

From my perspective, they made an outlandish statement that I vehemently disagreed with, if anything my response was more civil than usual.

EDIT: they not you

[–] all-knight-party@kbin.run -1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I'm not even the same person you were originally responding to. Just saying, if your goal is to get ideas across it's better to be nice. If you just want to dunk on people and sink to their level, then carry on.

[–] FiniteBanjo@lemmy.today 1 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Right, I'll add an edit. Sometimes discussion aren't meant for the other side, it's for the viewers.

[–] Fiivemacs@lemmy.ca 1 points 6 months ago (1 children)

If you disregard facts because of emotion, that's a you problem.

[–] all-knight-party@kbin.run 0 points 6 months ago

I'm making a general statement, not really representing my opinion in this particular conversation. If you care about what you're standing up for, you should do your best to get it across to people, the perception is as much the fault of the listener as it is on the conveyor of the information and how they do it.

[–] CaptObvious@literature.cafe 17 points 6 months ago

Maybe? The battle? It seems so. The war? Answer cloudy. Try again later.

[–] EfficientEffigy@lemmy.world 11 points 6 months ago (1 children)

TLDW? Did we win?

[–] CarbonatedPastaSauce@lemmy.world 1 points 6 months ago

Yeah, for once.

[–] Geosynchronous@sh.itjust.works 11 points 6 months ago (1 children)

I don't even play Helldivers but all of this drama made the weekend interesting

[–] Duamerthrax@lemmy.world 5 points 6 months ago

It renewed my avoidance of Live Service games.

[–] Wilzax@lemmy.world 2 points 6 months ago (2 children)

Video is private, can't watch.

[–] Turd_Ferg@sh.itjust.works 3 points 6 months ago

IDK why that happened. Im speaking with levelcap to see why it went private. Could be something juicy or just a copyright claim.

[–] EncryptKeeper@lemmy.world 1 points 6 months ago

Probably copyright claim

[–] AMillionNames@sh.itjust.works 1 points 6 months ago

Profit incentive wins the day again! Although there are times even it doesn't seem to.

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[–] littlebluespark@lemmy.world -1 points 6 months ago (2 children)

Only a fool blinded by shiny propaganda would even dare to hope so.

[–] Saledovil@sh.itjust.works 1 points 6 months ago

Sony likely won't try a blanket requirement again, however, they could try to do some kind of stealthy rollout, where non PSN players just get more and restricted to annoy them into signing up for PSN.

[–] DarkSpectrum@lemmy.world 0 points 6 months ago (1 children)

Not sure why the downvotes, seems a fair statement to me.

[–] littlebluespark@lemmy.world 0 points 6 months ago

The irony has layers. Sad to see, and I should've anticipated it, but... I still had hope for the species, I guess? Ho hum. Back to inevitability, I suppose.