Asklemmy

It's a good question and you've gotten some good answers. I'm going to lock this as it is getting political and we don't have the bandwidth to mod it well.

I feel cynical about this and don't think we live in a time when most people's minds can truly be changed. Therefore I choose not to engage most people about politics and so find it easier to like people.

Here's my experience:

My wife and I both grew up very conservative evangelical. Over the last 15 years, we went from right to left (which I'm so happy to have had someone on that path).

Meanwhile, a good chunk of our family has gone hard right or turned a blind eye to those who do. My wife and I have taken different approaches. I dropped off all social media where family was. I've established my own boundaries based on how batshit crazy they are and how much I want to stay in touch.

Cousin who posts all the conspiracy shit? I'll see you at wedding and funerals.

Dad who was an amazing father but listens to Tucker Carlson too much? We typically have 2 hours of conversation before we get to politics. So that's how long we spend together.

My wife deals with that stuff better. She posts on social media but in a kind and persuasive way, never arguing or getting mad on there, even though she is.

For me, the biggest reason why it's been good to take the more soft approach is the number of people who reach out to us (mostly my wife) because they are beginning to change their views too. They need a safe place to ask questions. This has included a niece who confided that she's gay and a sibling who went from moderate republican to climate activist vegan. Coming out the other side together bonds us even more.

So, boundaries. Be firm, but kind. Be patient and inviting for those asking questions. Also, yes therapy.

I don't argue anymore. You can't logic them out of something they didn't logic themselves into.

My father is too far gone and considered an "intellectual" man. My mom thinks she's "not that smart" (cool, thanks da), but she's become so much more open and accepting as she's gotten older and has shifted a lot of her views to be more progressive. Maybe because she realizes that my father, despite being very intelligent, is also an absolute moron who wrecks all his relationships. They're still together, though.

Therapy can help you cope with the situation, yeah.

My siblings are almost fully split on our views on religion and stuff.

Youngest to oldest: pastor, party girl, anxious wreck withdrawn from society, ex-military, brow-beaten family man, severe mental-illness-ridden mother, literal cult member, golden child/took over family business, ex-Rainbow gathering stereotype, and depressed IT guy who loves drugs, dogs, and the outdoors.

Things get better when you get far away from parents like this. Seriously.

Remember to debate with your brain not your heart. When you feel emotions taking hold relax and breathe.

Obviously the DeSantis thing is a lie. Ask them to show you you proof, they won't. I've flat out told friends that if they fall for a lie that's one thing. If they go around repeating it without seeing if it's true first then they are a tool of the person lying to them

Try to understand why they believe what they do. Ask them about their sources, and their experiences. Be friendly, and ready to question your own convictions, if you want a dialogue and not a fight.

Make understanding your main objective, don't expect to change their minds. Understanding why they think like they do will make your life easier. Them understanding your motives, that you're not simply a brainwashed woke brat, will make your life easier.

I ended up going very low contact with my arch-conservative family. Parents, sister and brother are all very right wing and loud about it. I haven’t spoken with my siblings in over a decade and speak to my parents about twice a year.

It has made my life calmer and more peaceful.

Well, things went well for a while because we didn't talk about things. Now we don't talk at all.

For context I'm left, and most of my relatives are some flavor of far right christo-fascist, white nationalist, or literal neo-nazis.

I openly speak out against their bullshit when they start spewing it.

I also did this with any of my relatives.

Of course at this point most of my relatives openly wish to hunt people like me (lefty queer folk) so most of us have blocked each other. Funnily enough primarily they've blocked me rather than me blocking them.

Something about calling them snowflakes when they'd inevitably lose their shit when faced with facts seemed to trigger them.

Edit: Here's a bit of advice more people should take to heart and something that I learned as a teen. Family is the relationship, blood doesn't matter. So if your relatives are terrible people, feel free to no longer consider them family.

Just totally stopped communicating. Not for everyone, but some things don't get better.

we haven’t spoken in years, and my life is much better for it. making the decision to go no-contact was a difficult one, but it was the right one. one day I’ll hear that one - then the other - has died. I won’t go to their funerals, but I may take the time - once in a while - to visit their graves on their birthdays.

to piss on them.

I don't. We don't talk. Relatives of mine, including one of my parents, sank into vaccine conspiracies, then followed that pipeline to Qanon, and then explained to me how they were waiting for Trump to lead his secret army to take down the government of my non-english-speaking, european country.

I gave them their keys back, I got my keys backs, I blocked them everywhere, I nuked my accounts on the social media they use (and where their posts steadily got worse). It's a hard decision, I still think about it often still (it's been nearly two years), but I will never talk to them again.

your first mistake is discussing politics with family members, your second mistake is adding family members to Instagram

One of my brothers is in an interracial gay marriage, my sister is in an interracial international gay marriage, and I married a trans woman. So they’re kind of running out of things they can bitch about in front of us.

There are two types of respect - respect of a human, and respect of an authority/superior. Parents demand the second, but that kind of respect is earned. You don't owe it to anyone.

back when i was younger and had the energy and focus to do so, i would engage with my father (whom holds unreasonable opinions such as you are up against with your family).

often, i would catch him making a point which directly contradicted an earlier point of his. i would then circle back to the earlier point and connect the two, breaking both of his arguments and hopefully forcing a concession.

but somehow he was able to blind himself to self-contradiction. it was infuriating.

the moral here is that i do not think it is possible to change anyone's mind, even if you are clear and rational and your point is water-tight.

your love for and enjoyment of them must be independent of political and religious differences. good luck!

My mother always voted center-left, I always voted center-right (this is not the US, we have some 40 parties), my sister voted left when young, then center-right after she started paying taxes.

We lived in the same home, we made healthy fun about each other's candidates.

We were all stubborn and we all knew it. We did not "respect" each other's opinions (we made fun of them), but we respected each other's right to have stupid (in each other's point of views) opinions. We knew the differences between criticizing opinions and making personal attacks, between disagreeing and death wish.

I guess before social media convinced everyone they're the bearer and defender of the only absolute truth, people were just easier to talk to.

I just don't talk about it

I know it's not really them anymore. A decade+ of Fox News everywhere they hang out and others they hang out with constantly reinforcing them, I know it's just a level of brainwashing we aren't gonna fix

Luckily we can still talk about normal shit because they're not so far gone that being a conservative nut job isn't their identity.

Dad and my stepmom are handled in radically different ways. I can talk with dad. When it comes to politics, we don’t agree on much, but we have similar ideas of right and wrong. He’s intelligent and thoughtful. I often ask him for his perspective on things in the news. We’ll usually come to different conclusions, but he can explain his point of view in a respectful way. I appreciate that. We probably both look at each other and think “he’s a knucklehead sometimes, but at least his heart is in the right place”.

My stepmom is something else entirely. There are a lot of things I like about her, but I absolutely can’t stand her politics, or her manner of “discussing” them. She can’t even say the name “Biden” without sounding like she’s spitting out something rotten. Her idea of “discussion” is a shallow, mindless summary of the last thing she saw on Fox News, and she interrupts you if you disagree even slightly. She gets louder, more emotional, and even more harsh and defensive the longer the conversation goes on (the most I’ve been able to withstand is about three minutes). I go out of my way to avoid mentioning anything political when she’s within earshot.

I remind myself that compared to a lot of people, I have it easy.

1. Parents are southern baptist and tithe 10% yearly

2. Constantly complain about socialism, and taxes

3. Go on mission trips to Haiti to help build homes

4. Constantly complain about refugees and immigration

5. Claims to have lgbt, black, etc minority friends

6. Sees nothing wrong with current Supreme Court trend taking rights away from said minority groups…

7/8. Think of any two things that are opposites between real life, what religion should be about, and politics… and it is someway twisted in a way you wouldn’t think would be possible.

TLDR: there is no way of dealing with this cognitive dissonance. It is maddening. I’ve gotten to the point of trolling my fam with republican Jesus lol. It’s the only thing that makes me at least laugh about the insanity.

We discuss it and agree to disagree on some things. We don’t disagree on all things. But my parents are generally a bit more liberal than me on certain things.

Interestingly the biggest things we disagree on on subjects that generally require deep technical knowledge to understand and where the talking points often completely miss that.

So things like privacy/telecom/technical regulation (ie Patriot Act stuff), guns, tax/economic policy etc.

In the subjects I’m not well versed on, my reliance on more simplistic talking points often don’t pan/scale to the nuance. And the same goes the other way.

The book "Nonviolent Communication" by Marshall Rosenberg has a lot of wisdom to offer this issue. The author moderated and helped to resolve political tensions between countries, for example. His work honestly changed how I view talking to others with opposing beliefs.

It depends on how open they are to listening. If they won't listen, I don't talk about my views.

Cognitive dissonance is an impossible nut to crack for anyone but the person experiencing it. Just say your piece with no expectations; at least you will know you are honest, and you never know - even a tiny crack can shatter the bubble. Probably won't.

My dad believes tons of right wing conspiracy theories, it's like a hobby for him. Sometimes they even contradict each other (e.g. the war in Ukraine isn't happening vs. Putin is fighting against wokism and the "Jewish plan"), but that doesn't seem to bother him.

I tried to argue with him, tried understanding, but every time I ask questions that stretch his understanding he gets irritated and says I'm always nitpicking and that I have a closed mind.

So when he brings them up I just nod and change the subject. We're cool if we talk about anything else.

There's a book about talking to people on different sides of the isle by Justin Lee, I recommend it! But otherwise I prefer to just show love in whatever ways they can receive. I'm fine with respectful discussions but will happily excuse myself from arguments I didn't sign up for.

Half the time I just smile and nod with whatever they say because at the end of the day, they're my parents, they have done a great job as my parents, and they believe what they think is right, but they are just brainwashed. The other half of the time I just ask not to talk about politics if it starts bothering me.

Find the middle ground you agree on, then focus/build on that. Paint yourself as “on their side,” not their enemy.

But most people don’t care to change their mind. They care to see if you agree and expect you to change yours to match. So battling for the purpose of battling only leaves everyone exhausted.