It's like the mid 90s all over again. Let's see if anything happens this time.
this post was submitted on 04 Oct 2024
568 points (98.1% liked)
Technology
59679 readers
3668 users here now
This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.
Our Rules
- Follow the lemmy.world rules.
- Only tech related content.
- Be excellent to each another!
- Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
- Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
- Politics threads may be removed.
- No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
- Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
- Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed
Approved Bots
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
I guess it could be said that Edge has an unfair...edge?
Take your upvote and gtfo. Lol
It was an edgy comment.
Yikes, all these browser-based puns are a bit much for this little internet explorer. I'm out.
load more comments
(2 replies)
I’m not defending Microsoft… but if we’re going to go after a tech company for leveraging their other assets to give themselves an unfair advantage can we also go after Google?
In the first releases of Edge, Microsoft tried to build a new web browser from scratch to compete with Google Chrome. By google kept changing YouTube’s code so that videos would playback janky on Edge. Microsoft eventually gave up trying to fix for YouTubes ongoing changes and now Edge is based on Chromium (the same open source web browser maintained by Google, that chrome os built on). Google leveraged YouTube to prevent completion from Edge.
And now Google is blocking ad blocking extensions so that users are forced to see more google ads in their browser.
Microsoft’s has leveraged their unfair advantage to get a little over 5% market share.
Google’s leveraged their unfair advantage to get 66% of the market.
Both companies need a hard smack down, but I want to see Google taken down too.
Please, please do act on google too. Didn't knew about YT thing, but god I loved Spartan Edge. It was soo...resource unintensive. It...simply did it job, was quick, low resource, looked good... :( I switched to it from chrome and then it became chrome.
YT does a lot of sneaky sneaky stuff. My Firefox constantly lagged on YT pages until one day I installed UserAgent-Switcher and pretended I was a Chrome. The lag went away.
And no it doesn’t work now.
load more comments
(4 replies)
Any source that YouTube is the reason that Edge switched to chromium?
I'm betting it's just cheaper and easier than making their own engine.
They’re was never any evidence of google’s wrongdoing, the accusation came from former MS edge developers:
https://www.developer-tech.com/news/edge-developer-google-youtube-chrome-browsers/
Officially Google denied it:
https://www.theverge.com/2018/12/19/18148736/google-youtube-microsoft-edge-intern-claims
You may be right, this could have been MS couldn’t make a better browser and pulled the plug, and the devs just blamed google.
Old Edge was a better browser
more responsive/lower overhead
load more comments
(10 replies)
Please submit a second copy of that letter, but replace Windows with Android, PC with Mobile, Microsoft with Google, and Edge with Chrome.
Please submit a third copy of that letter, but replace Windows with iOS, PC with iPhone, Microsoft with Apple, and Edge with Safari.
As Edge comes pre-installed by default on Windows machines, users must navigate the Microsoft offering in order to download their browser of choice.
What's the actual alternative they want here? That users look up download URLs on other devices and download their browser of choice via command line using ~~cURL~~ Invoke-WebRequest? That ISPs provide browser installers on USB sticks?
Also, it's not like MS is cornering the market on browser share here. Even with this "unfair advantage" they've only scraped together a 5% slice of browser usage.
For a while when you installed Windows, the first time user setup gave you a choice of popular browsers and it handled the download and install.
Now Microsoft is actively trying to sabotage other browsers with popups and office apps bypassing the default browser setting.
load more comments
(4 replies)
IMO edge coming pre-installed isn’t a big deal. But I’d like to be able to uninstall edge and not have Windows periodically try to trick me into setting edge as my default browser again.
Basically either offer users a dialog box asking which browser they'd like to use or offer the browsers in the Microsoft Store.
And stop telling me that "The Internet is better using Edge", Microsoft.
load more comments
(11 replies)
Not to forget than when using bing, if you look for words like Firefox or Chrome, you get a large banner saying to use Edge instead. Super shady stuff
Not to mention that Microsoft forces you to use a Microsoft account when you create your account on your home computer which is then automatically logged in to edge and *bing so that they can track and quantize more of every single thing you do on the internet to monetize you
load more comments
(11 replies)
This doesn't make that behavior any less scummy, but have you tried using any Google website on a browser that isn't chrome?
load more comments
(2 replies)
MS is literally back to square one its about damn time.
They're even worse now and aggressively pressure you to use edge if it's not the default.
why go after microsoft.
Go after fucking google.
Chromium is the plague, not Edge.
Isn't Edge also chromium?
Yes, and its a nasty story thats all unofficial cause no one is ever gonna go on the record, at least not for another 10-20 years when it comes out in someones book..
but the short of it is, Edge had its own browser engine, but google kept making changes to youtube and other google sites that broke Edges performance and made it run like dogshit, while leaving chromium based browsers alone.
after many instances of sabotage > microsoft workaround > google sabotage> microsoft workaround. Microsoft finally gave up and remade Edge as a chromium based browser.
load more comments
(8 replies)
It's possible to go after both. M$ has some fucked up practices that trick the user into using edge that shouldn't be okay
load more comments
(4 replies)
load more comments
(1 replies)
You could say the same about Android and iOS. They are preloaded with a web browser not many people change. In fact I've noticed that many users (mostly older) using Android don't even know what browser they are using, since they just type shit into Google widget on their home screen.
IIRC Samsung devices default to a Samsung web browser labelled "Internet". You wouldn't want to disable the "Internet", right?
iOS seems even more egregious, where it's internally using Safari no matter what browser you install, giving the illusion of choice.
load more comments
(3 replies)
Ooo what about safari on mac? Isn't it the same thing but just not as hated?
Forget mac, it's even worse on iOS/iPadOS, where all third-party browsers must use Safari's rendering engine too.
load more comments
(3 replies)
It would be if Mac’s held the dominant market position for computers, yes.
load more comments
(3 replies)
load more comments
(4 replies)
I agree with going after the Edge Lords and making things more fair...but I'm guessing Chrome is the most used we browser by a long shot even on windows so the “No platform independent browser can aspire to match Edge's unparalleled distribution advantage on Windows." part feels like users are comfortable stepping over Edge's corpse to download chrome anyway.
load more comments
(8 replies)
A letter seen by Reuters, sent by Vivaldi, Waterfox, and Wavebox, and supported by a group of web developers, also supports Opera’s move to take the EC to court over its decision to exclude Microsoft Edge from being subject to the Digital Markets Act (DMA).
OK...
Shouldn't they be fighting Chrome, more than anything? Surely there's a legal avenue for that, though I guess there's a risk of getting deprioritized by Google and basically disappearing.
Yeah they can't fight Chrome, they are Chrome.
load more comments
(2 replies)
...and we all know what that advantage can do! (Covertly looks in IE's direction)
I completely understand where this is coming from, but I'm just a little confused about what the solution would be. For the average consumer and certainly the target users for Windows, shipping with a browser is the expected norm, and none are expected to open a terminal, much less run tools like winget. I guess you could have a setup dialog of major browsers to choose from?
I can think of some options
Level 1: Allow uninstall of edge. They can have the engine still for store/background processes, but no user icon. You can use edge to install other browsers then remove it.
Level 2: same as level one, but it comes "uninstalled". OOBE asks you to choose a browser.
Level 3: They rip out the deep integration they knew damn well they shouldn't have done because their asses were handed to them in the IE days.
load more comments
(6 replies)
Yup. Teams ignores default browser and opens URLs in Edge. I have to right click copy and open in Firefox. I refuse to be forced to use Edge
load more comments
(5 replies)
As it's based on chromium, I'd call what it has a handicap and just keep on using Firefox.
load more comments
(2 replies)
Windows is absolutely abusing their position as the dominant OS to push their other products. The number of "no don't do that" messages and pop ups when trying to install chrome on a windows computer is clearly anti-competitive, and the only reason microsoft has been getting away with it is because Edge/etc hasn't achieved enough market share.
running "winget install firefox" in an elevated powershell gets you a better browser without ever opening edge. but then you still cannot uninstall it and all the other shit about it still stays active.
view more: next ›