I find it quite strange that "old and weird" seems to work better than "corrupt and criminal".
this post was submitted on 30 Jul 2024
972 points (98.3% liked)
politics
19148 readers
2214 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Probably for 2 reasons:
-
quote "all politicians are corrupt and criminal" so this tactic doesn't land (look at the dem senator from NJ)
-
few people know convicted felons but they do know "old and weird" people, so they can better draw personal parallels
I think the "weird" attribution has a way of infecting his supporters as well.
If you support a criminal, that doesn't necessarily make you a criminal. If you support a corrupt politician, that doesn't make you a corrupt politician.
But if you support somebody weird? Well that makes you weird. Trump's weirdness infects you. It's the cheese touch of politics.
For a decade now there has been a certain crowd who considers Trump’s criminality and general disregard for truth to be cool in a “gangster” way. Gangsters are leaders.
Weirdos, not so much.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(1 replies)
It's also a plausible way out. Someone can convince themself that Trump was not as old and weird 10 years ago, so they did not make a mistake voting for him then
load more comments
(4 replies)
I think it's because for so long they've relied on Democrats/people on the left (I say that because it's not just in the US, it's become the right-wing tactic all over the place) being serious and arguing in good faith, IE: they'll just say the wildest shit that's blatantly untrue, and people on the left tend to bust out the facts and links to long explanations of why that's false, and they just counter it with more nonsense until their opponents get tired and quit, then they proclaim victory. But if you just go "you're weird, fuck you" and then refuse to follow up on it they kind of don't know what to do with it.
Also, the amount it's pissing them off means it's working, everyone keep doing it!
load more comments
(5 replies)
It's because it's a fascist movement.
Fascism is organized around a strong leader who supposedly embodies the values of the movement. A fascist leader isn't a leader who's thoughtful and fair, they're strong, determined, filled with righteous anger, etc.
Corrupt and criminal can be twisted into those characteristics. It's not "corruption", it's taking advantage of suckers. Something you have to be clever and ruthless to do. It's not "criminal", it's ignoring laws meant for lesser people.
On the other hand, a fascist leader's image isn't compatible with weakness and strangeness. Fascism is all about claiming the national identity is under threat by "others", immigrants, intellectuals, homosexuals, etc. The fascist leader needs to be seen to embody all that's good and right about the true national spirit. But, if they're seen as weak and weird, that's not something anybody wants to associate with.
To add to that I'd like to quote Ian Danskin (aka Inuendo Studios) from his guest lecture about Gamergate at UC Merced:
Bob Altemeyer has this survey he uses to study authoritarianism. He divides respondents into people with low, average, and high authoritarian sentiments, and then tells them what the survey has measured and asks, “what score do you think is best to have: low, average, or high?”
People with low authoritarian sentiments say it’s best to be low. People with average authoritarian sentiments also say it’s best to be low. But people with high authoritarian sentiments? They say it’s best to be average. Altemeyer finds, across all his research, that reactionaries want to aggress, but only if it is socially acceptable. They want to know they are the in-group and be told who the out-group is. They don’t particularly care who the out-group is, Altemeyer finds they’ll aggress against any group an authority figure points to, even, if they don’t notice it, a group that contains them. They just have to believe the in-group is the norm.
load more comments
(4 replies)
load more comments
(4 replies)
load more comments
(7 replies)
The reason it works is because there is no refuting it other than, "Nah uh!" It's almost the equivalent to repeating someone's argument back to them in a tone to sound stupid. HOWEVER, this tactic works when arguing with a kindergartner, so it works here too.
It's also a primal fear for narcissistic men to be called 'weird' or 'creepy' by attractive women.
load more comments
(12 replies)
Get out of my brain.
I was literally just wondering why it's so effective and I think it's this.
Most liberal "insults" are draped in facts and figures, to the point that Republicans just close their ears and say AlTeRnAtIvE fAcTs.
I think the simplicity, and it's fact-less insult cuts through their reasoning brains (which there wasn't much of) and hits them in the emotional centers.
I mean....it took Democrats 6 years to figure this out?
Better late than never but happy we're finally hitting below the belt.
Democrats finally learn how stupid undecided voters are
Democrats need to meet people where they are. Most people want to be manipulated and told what to think and do.
Honestly, that's how are brains are wired. The group is more important than the truth.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(3 replies)
Laughter is a great weapon, as even the Irish Bards of old knew. And the plus point is that it is true, they are old and weird. They want to go round inspecting children's genitals.....definitely weird. They rather mothers die than get medical treatment in an event of a dangerous pregnancy. Likewise, they think child marriages are OK. They think forcing women to have babies is OK but passing laws to help those babies live is not. They want to go back in time and roll back all the progress society has made in being kinder, fairer and more inclusive. They love conspiracies and think they have special secret knowledge . There is so much more,I hope someone turns it all into a catchy song that goes viral.
There's two sides to that.
Some of them are like tucker Carlson or Boris Johnson. They look ridiculous on purpose so that's what people talk about instead of the horrendous shit they're advocating for.
So by all means laugh at them, it hurts their follower count. But don't outright dismiss them.
They might be stupid and weird that doesn't make them less dangerous
I think the point is that they are all old, weird, and dangerous. Vance isn't old, but he is weird and dangerous.
And let's be clear, this is a different kind of weird. I'm weird, but I'm weird because I like kids shows, make bad jokes, and pick at my fingernails.
They're weird because they like to fuck kids and underage teens (a surprisingly large portion, anyway), make decisions that hurt the people they want giving them money and support, and want to pick which immigrants are the "bad" ones.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(2 replies)
load more comments
(8 replies)
Yep. Watching the Republican cult of personality be exposed this way has given me genuine hope for the future.
It's been ten years since that freak started remaking the Republican party in his own image. Ten years since his face and voice started dominating the news cycle for no good reason (and lots of bad ones). Ten years of his clown show.
But now, at long last, I have hope that it will finally end. That the name "Donald Trump" will fade from our political vocabulary, and be spoken in shame and disgust when spoken at all.
That the name “Donald Trump” will fade from our political vocabulary, and be spoken in shame and disgust when spoken at all.
Don't forget the part where all the Republicans pretend they never really supported him in the first place.
This.
Never let anyone who identifies as or admits to voting republican get away with this. Always remind them they had a convicted criminal rapist pussy grabber who stole from from a kids cancer charity running the show. Not just a candidate, he ran the whole clown show.
Doesn't matter if it's an uncle, dad, mom, grandpa or grandma; always be relentless with this message and have no room for sympathy or forgiveness. Be the bigger person? Time to 'heal'? No, no, no. These people wanted to destroy America and you have to throw that into their face relentlessly.
Sure, have a family dinner or some party with family and friends but the moment politics comes up, you hammer this message home and tell them the discussion on politics is over because they have been proven not to be trusted at all when politics is involved. Uncle Bob want to talk fishing lures? Sure, no problem. Uncle Bob wants to talk politics in any way, shape or form? Be very, very fucking brutal in cutting the traitors of and shut them down. They have lost any and all admission to discuss (or, in my opinion, be part of) politics.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(2 replies)
The Republican Party eagerly embraced him. They wanted this.
This needs to be repeated over and over. Remind everyone when Trump is gone. He isn't the threat people, he is a threat.
load more comments
(3 replies)
When reactionaries tell you to stop something it's because it is effective.
If they cry and foam at the mouth you should go even harder.
They're a minority of weirdos and should be reminded of such at every opportunity.
load more comments
(1 replies)
Republicans are so old... and just soo weird.
And trump doesn't laugh or have a dog?
There's a lot of other very bad things going on, but they are also just... They're just so fucking weird?
load more comments
(22 replies)
Yes, but doesn't he look tired?
ok, i'm eating crow now, for criticizing the "he's weird" strategy. #happyiwaswrong
they really are mentally 5 years old
“When I look at myself in the first grade and I look at myself now, I’m basically the same. The temperament is not that different.” -Donald Trump https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/04/opinions/president-trump-six-year-old-with-nuclear-weapons-dantonio/index.html
load more comments
(2 replies)
It makes sense. You can't reason with it, you can't use descriptive accurate language because they might not understand, or fail to understand why it applies to them.
Weird - to them - means "non-conforming" and that is a terrible, terrible thing for a conservative.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(5 replies)
At this point can we consider that MAGA is the "new" and Americanized version of the Nazi party, and that Trump is trying to become a somehow worse version of Hitler?
Sure, there's no rhetoric about the Arian race in the public literature, but the ideals and concepts are pretty similar. Instead of considering anyone who is non-white, non-blonde, non-blue eyed, to be less than, it's instead about "God loving Christians" and basically the concept of, if you're not with us then you are not an American.
Transpose some conceptual groups for fairly equal in size/scope groups, and it's essentially the same playbook.
Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it. C'mon America... You were a big factor in defeating the Nazis.... DON'T BECOME THEM
no rhetoric about the Arian race
Pretty much a direct parallel
load more comments
(8 replies)
Look, I'm sorry I didn't vote in 2016 but I've voted every time since then and started paying attention to local politics. Now I have a protected bike lane next to my neighborhood and the roads aren't full of holes
load more comments
(1 replies)
So my buddy and I were bored in the car yesterday and I made up a game called “let’s bet how many minutes it will take me to scan through AM radio and hear that the immigrants are invading.” I was really sad when I won in, I shit you not, less than 3 minutes. But before he got to that when I first tuned in he was going on a whole rant about being butthurt that the orange one was being called a weirdo. It really upset the guy which was just absolutely hilarious. Oh and he managed to slip a transphobic pronoun joke in the middle of the rant. Remember all of this happened within less than 3 minutes of me starting at the bottom of the AM dial.
I love in the south and the radio is a fucked up place. It's mostly all Christian or Republican talk radio. They tell people how they should think. like some random dude on the radio has all the answers.
load more comments
(1 replies)
I'm weird as shit. My life is a freak show and a fail whale working together to make a fail-ipolis.
And I'm fucking goofy.
Though I'm not trying to lead a nation with it. So I take no offense with this.
load more comments
(5 replies)
still don't understand what's wrong with being weird. republicans just hate it because their bigoted mind associate it with being different and they hate that.
The message isn't for democrats. You insult people based on what they find insulting.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(3 replies)
The only problem I have is I'm weird and I think weird is cool, I like weird people and I love towns that have a motto that is like keep Portland weird. I celebrate weird, but I guess it's time to normalize the weird I've been supporting and ostracize the truly weird
Weird is neutral on it's own, it's context and tone and stuff that gives it positive and negative weight
load more comments
(12 replies)
load more comments
(7 replies)
I don't know if Republicans hate it as much as we just love it.
I tested it on the chuds in my fantasy football chat, and they lost their minds. It works.
load more comments
(3 replies)
load more comments
(4 replies)
view more: next ›